Sept 2016 New User Contest "Depth of Field" (WIP Thread)

Saphirewild

Thanks Linwelly for the tips for 3Delight.

I know I am going to have to add some stuff to this for everyone to get the whole story (The small child is a toddler)

Thank you also Kismet for your advise.

I know I am going to have to tweak all of my charactors poses

I was more wondering about the DOF if it was enough of it or do I need to tweak that as well?

Linwelly

Saphirewild said:

Thanks Linwelly for the tips for 3Delight.

I know I am going to have to add some stuff to this for everyone to get the whole story (The small child is a toddler)

Thank you also Kismet for your advise.

I know I am going to have to tweak all of my charactors poses

I was more wondering about the DOF if it was enough of it or do I need to tweak that as well?

I would suggest to add your scene together and then think about the DOF, as it depends what you want to put into the focus of attention and how much of the rest of the scene needs to be clear to still make sense. I often make several copies of one camera and try different DOF settings, experimenting with having something in front on focus or all in the back.

Linwelly

DvoraszeniaStudios said:

Linwelly said:

this developed very fast ! Lights and effects are really getting together. Two things I have to mention, for one the lightning from the robot would make more sense to me if is was surrounding the robot, instead of going of to the sky. Try using a geometry shell and ad the lightning there (take care of the opacity/ translucency channel). The other thing I'm wondering about is the rather clear cut edge of the police car lights. They look much better now but I would expect the outlines blurred. Good work altogether!

Ok, I redid the police car lights, I had to make a new light bar using geometry editor, so now the police lights are the correct shape. I spent a lot of time on the electric sparks, but making a geometry shell I couldn't get a realistic look, so I finally just created a much smaller effect, between the chest and neck area which I think looks more realistic (for a short-circuiting robotic killing machine, which is probably pretty well armored, so he shouldn't look like a lightning storm.)

Finally, I decided the DOF did not look quite right to me. So I played around with the f-stop. I wanted to get the robot in just a little bit sharper focus to sharpen up the sparking / ricochet action better, but also keep him out of focus just enough as to keep a sense of motion there, and not detract from the main focus on the hero. Also I wanted the background just slightly sharper focus as well, now its easier to tell thats a doorway back there. 

 

 

that short circuit thing looks mcuh better! and the other improvements show as well, for the finishing touch I still would thing some dust and smaller bit of rblle flieing around would make the thing complete

Linwelly

FastKatt said:

Updated. @ewcarman, thank you for the great ideas!

wow this is looking really good! Pretty much finished I would say

Shinji Ikari 9th

Decided that I'd better get back on track last night and knocked this out. Version g.

isidorn

Shinji Ikari 9th said:

Decided that I'd better get back on track last night and knocked this out. Version g.

What first caught my attention was the two > shaped lights at the head and butt of the background character. But other than that, it all looks good to me.

FrankTheTank

  

aaráribel caađo

DvoraszeniaStudios said:

@Shinji Ikari 9th, I think changing the armor on the guy in front was too much. I don't think you would want armor so shiny/mirrorlike that it would be easily visible to the enemy. I think your armor was better before.

Agreed. It makes it look more like toy armor (chromed plastic) than combat or even ceremonial, polished metal armor. That's extra true when the cheetah woman has slightly scuffed up armor. I'd say as a whole, your shiny metal surfaces are much too shiny. They don't look like real metals when they get that bright in areas where there would be walking and other contact, even if they started out chromed. I'm just coming to this thread now, so I don't know if the depth of field element has been discussed for this, but I think you hit it perfectly for a selective focus effect. The focus puts the eye on the heroes very nicely.

aaráribel caađo

My first time entering a DAZ contest. I called this "Shallow" for the extremely shallow depth of field. I'm not sure about the way the key light is reflecting in the glasses.

dawnblade

Guardians of the Ancient Relic, rendered in 3Delight

Mort Augur prop
Jepe's FlameZ, ElementZ and SteamZ for torches, special effect and fog
Battle Cat (not sure why right front paw rendered with grey toes)
G2F with Skull Queen armor and Leyton hair
Fantasy Coinage, Liqueur book box

Hope you're not tired of skeletons, because I think that throne is begging for one! :)  Treasure box in its place for now.

I'm trying for a night/dark scene. I think the red circular special effect is a bit loud and might be defeating the purpose of the DOF, but I wanted something more mystical than the default red light that came with Mort Augur.

Please let me know what you think!

Saphirewild

Linwelly said:

Saphirewild said:

Thanks Linwelly for the tips for 3Delight.

I know I am going to have to add some stuff to this for everyone to get the whole story (The small child is a toddler)

Thank you also Kismet for your advise.

I know I am going to have to tweak all of my charactors poses

I was more wondering about the DOF if it was enough of it or do I need to tweak that as well?

I would suggest to add your scene together and then think about the DOF, as it depends what you want to put into the focus of attention and how much of the rest of the scene needs to be clear to still make sense. I often make several copies of one camera and try different DOF settings, experimenting with having something in front on focus or all in the back.

Thanks so much for the feedback Linwelly, I am going to work on that tonite and then will be back tomorrow with maybe a couple of renders just to see where I want to go with it.

FrankTheTank

  

aaráribel caađo

dawnblade said:

Guardians of the Ancient Relic, rendered in 3Delight

Mort Augur prop
Jepe's FlameZ, ElementZ and SteamZ for torches, special effect and fog
Battle Cat (not sure why right front paw rendered with grey toes)
G2F with Skull Queen armor and Leyton hair
Fantasy Coinage, Liqueur book box

Hope you're not tired of skeletons, because I think that throne is begging for one! :)  Treasure box in its place for now.

I'm trying for a night/dark scene. I think the red circular special effect is a bit loud and might be defeating the purpose of the DOF, but I wanted something more mystical than the default red light that came with Mort Augur.

Please let me know what you think!

This is a hard image to do depth of field on, because you've got such a shallow image area—the distance between the woman, the tiger and the box, and the background is much shorter than the distance before the scene elements—but it's also very wide. That makes it hard to use depth of field to bring the eyes attention to what you want the viewer to see. The skull throne seems to have low res textures on it, which kind of create a strong false DoF effect (e.g., it's blurred), even thought the box sitting on it is in focus). Perhaps this isn't the best scene to use DoF on.

IceDragonArt

Finally came up with something.  Took a LONG time to render but my laptop doesn't have the same speed as my pc.  I'm pretty happy with this, I wish I could have had her looking directly down the arrow and looking into the camera but no matter what I tried the bow was in the way.  And I wanted her looking directly in the camera, like she sees you but its not going to stop her from shooting at whatever she is aiming at.

dawnblade

aaráribel caađo said:

This is a hard image to do depth of field on, because you've got such a shallow image area—the distance between the woman, the tiger and the box, and the background is much shorter than the distance before the scene elements—but it's also very wide. That makes it hard to use depth of field to bring the eyes attention to what you want the viewer to see. The skull throne seems to have low res textures on it, which kind of create a strong false DoF effect (e.g., it's blurred), even thought the box sitting on it is in focus). Perhaps this isn't the best scene to use DoF on.

Thank you aaráribel caađo! I think you are right. Even when I was putting it together I just wasn't sure I could make it work. I'll look to another scene.

Kismet2012

aaráribel caađo said:

My first time entering a DAZ contest. I called this "Shallow" for the extremely shallow depth of field. I'm not sure about the way the key light is reflecting in the glasses.

You have created a lovely portrait.  I can see the slight DOF on the right side of the image.  My eyes are drawn right to her eyes and I thought the reflections on the glasses would bother me but they don't seem to.

My only concern is I am not sure there is enough DOF.  You have the image cropped very close to the figure.  If you can bring it back even a little bit and apply some kind of a background (even a plane with an image placed behind her) it would be more relevant to this month's theme.  Novica started a thread in the Art Studio forum for free background images.  You can find it here. 

 

 

 

Kismet2012

dawnblade said:

aaráribel caađo said:

This is a hard image to do depth of field on, because you've got such a shallow image area—the distance between the woman, the tiger and the box, and the background is much shorter than the distance before the scene elements—but it's also very wide. That makes it hard to use depth of field to bring the eyes attention to what you want the viewer to see. The skull throne seems to have low res textures on it, which kind of create a strong false DoF effect (e.g., it's blurred), even thought the box sitting on it is in focus). Perhaps this isn't the best scene to use DoF on.

Thank you aaráribel caađo! I think you are right. Even when I was putting it together I just wasn't sure I could make it work. I'll look to another scene.

That has to be one of the hardest decisions we can make.  Knowing when to scrap an idea that just isn't working. 

Sometimes an image just doesn't work in one situation but is perfect for another.

 

Kismet2012

Ice Dragon Art said:

Finally came up with something.  Took a LONG time to render but my laptop doesn't have the same speed as my pc.  I'm pretty happy with this, I wish I could have had her looking directly down the arrow and looking into the camera but no matter what I tried the bow was in the way.  And I wanted her looking directly in the camera, like she sees you but its not going to stop her from shooting at whatever she is aiming at.

A really nice start @Ice Dragon Art.  Just a couple of things I see.  The hair is following her right ear (our left side).  Maybe it is the DOF but I do not see any shadows.  Is this a 3DL render?

I think the composition and DOF are great.  My eyes go right to her face which is framed beautifully between the bow and the string.

IceDragonArt

No its Iray.  I kow there is a trick to get the hair to unfollow the ear but I can't find the thread it was in and I don't remember how to do it. It also may just be the hair it rounds out and gets thicker right in that area. 

IceDragonArt

But I really need to find the unfollow the ear button and write it in my notes lol.

FrankTheTank

  

Kismet2012

Ice Dragon Art said:

But I really need to find the unfollow the ear button and write it in my notes lol.

http://www.daz3d.com/forums/viewthread/15743/

 

Must be the DOF affecting the shadows.

harrykim

Ice Dragon Art said:

But I really need to find the unfollow the ear button and write it in my notes lol.

It was dicussed in WIP thread august contest on page 4

 

IceDragonArt

Ahh thank you!   And I will also see if rotating the background looks better.  I have a ton of metal and stone and bone shaders so I am sure I can find something for the arrowhead.

dawnblade

Kismet2012 said:

That has to be one of the hardest decisions we can make.  Knowing when to scrap an idea that just isn't working. 

Sometimes an image just doesn't work in one situation but is perfect for another.

Thanks @Kismet2012. Glad I received feedback in that regard quickly!

aaráribel caađo

Kismet2012 said:

aaráribel caađo said:

My first time entering a DAZ contest. I called this "Shallow" for the extremely shallow depth of field. I'm not sure about the way the key light is reflecting in the glasses.

You have created a lovely portrait.  I can see the slight DOF on the right side of the image.  My eyes are drawn right to her eyes and I thought the reflections on the glasses would bother me but they don't seem to.

My only concern is I am not sure there is enough DOF.  You have the image cropped very close to the figure.  If you can bring it back even a little bit and apply some kind of a background (even a plane with an image placed behind her) it would be more relevant to this month's theme.  Novica started a thread in the Art Studio forum for free background images.  You can find it here. 

 

 

 

Thanks. I'll throw in some physical geometry to get a good blur and bring out the camera a bit.

dawnblade

Ice Dragon Art said:

Finally came up with something.  Took a LONG time to render but my laptop doesn't have the same speed as my pc.  I'm pretty happy with this, I wish I could have had her looking directly down the arrow and looking into the camera but no matter what I tried the bow was in the way.  And I wanted her looking directly in the camera, like she sees you but its not going to stop her from shooting at whatever she is aiming at.

I really like what you have done here, Ice Dragon Art. I agree with @Kismet2012 that you have framed the Dark Elf well! I've always like the Elven outfit, but I just wish it came with more than one pose with the bow, because I've run into that problem with the bow being in the way too.

As I'm looking at the arrow in her bow, is it different than the arrows in her quiver? I don't have DS running now, so I can't pull the name of the material. The green arrows in her quiver I think are the default color. It looks like when you applied a different material to her outfit you might have also changed the arrow in the bow, but not the arrows in her quiver? It's hard to tell so I could be wrong.

Anyway, nice work!

sueya

I have altered my first image following your advice. Further feedback is welcome.

unLight865

blackroguedreams said:

I think I'm pretty much happy with the lighting as is, might knock down the exposure that's about it. Thoughts?

Get rid of the confetti-effect, maybe?   ( Ok ok, I'm regularly having trouble with that, too )

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FastKatt said:

Updated. @ewcarman, thank you for the great ideas!

Nice - which fire were you using and did you need to tweak it to look like this?

---

 

Some updates from me - no new buildings yet, but I made an (slightly unfinished) emission-map for the dragon, moved some water nearby, and added a ship (Drakkar) and a Troll (Troll for Genesis) onboard, as well as some lightning (Orestes Electromancy, non-Iray version)...

Also improved the fire by adding a more transparent geometry-shell - though I'd prefer a gradient-transmap when I get to it...

Oh, and the ground and water are still from the castle-creator - admittedly it's too linear for a river, I'll propably better look for a replacement.

 

Please give some feedback . ( especially on the different camera views - and no, not all of them have DoF yet; also, I'm not sure as of which to use as entry... - maybe C30 and C27 ? )

(p.s.: Am currently re-rendering Camera 27, it seems it wasn't frozen, but just slowed down to a crawl...)

 

Camera 30 :

Camera 30 again, with troll+boat :

Camera 27 :

Camera 33 :

Camera 36, rendering finished :

Camera 36 at the start of rendering :

p.p.s: On the last 2 pics you can see my trouble with the "confetti" - at 0% progress (last pic) the renders sometimes look better then at 100% (second-last pic) - any idea why that is so?

 

[edit: Just put the non-reduced versions of the pics into the attachements.]

[edit2: Made clear(er) which pictures I was referring to.]

FrankTheTank