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Ryzen or Intel chip for Carrara ? Thanks for advice. :)

HeadwaxHeadwax Posts: 9,983
edited June 2017 in Carrara Discussion

Greetings, just about to crunch down and order a new computer.

I just use Carrara and Occasionally Studio. I do a lot of photoshop work at the same time while Carrara is rendering.

I also run a few other softwares as well at the same time for image processing. I don't do animations. I don't play computer games (life's short) plus my joy stick broke, it was very painful...

Anyways, these are my two choices. I'll be going with Windows 10 pro and 32 gig ram, courtesy of advice in another thread (thank you)

I'l also be getting 2 times 2 terabyte hardrive.

As far as I can understand, the Ryzen has more cores? Are the extra cores in the Ryzen going to make any difference in Carrara ??

Thanks for any other advice too :)  !

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AMD Ryzen 1700X 8C/16T CPU OC
ASUS Prime B350-Plus motherboard
Cooler Master Hyper 212 Turbo Cooler
16G DDR4 Kingston Ram
256G SSD M.2 Intel 6 Gen PCI Express + Seagate 2TB HDD
ASUS 8G GeForce GTX 1070 PCI Express
Cooler Master MasterBox 5 + 650W Power Fractal Design
22 Speed DVD RW ASUS
Built in Gigabit Lan USB 3.0 SATA 3.0
 

-------------------------------------------

 

Intel i7 7700K CPU Overclock up to 4.6G
Noctua D15 super Cooler
ASUS Z270-P Motherboard
16G DDR4 2133Mhz Kingston
250G Samsung 960 EVO M.2 SSD PCI Express + 1TB WD 7200rpm
ASUs 8G DDR5 Dual GTX1070 PCI Express
Cooler Master CM693 Case with 750W Power
DVD RW SATA

Built in Gigabit Lan USB 3.0 SATA 3.0 SATA Raid.

 

Post edited by Headwax on

Comments

  • cdordonicdordoni Posts: 583
    edited June 2017

    The Ryzen seems like a no brainer based on price/performance. My concern, perhaps unmerited, is that since its a new design there might be a few things that are not quite working as they should.

    The extra cores and threads will help a lot, especially if you are using apps simultaneously.

    Post edited by cdordoni on
  • UnifiedBrainUnifiedBrain Posts: 3,588

    With the two system choices you presented, it is probably a coin flip which is better if you are not doing animation.  But like cdordoni, I would still lean towards more cores.  Carrara apparently uses multiple cores very well. 

    Are you planning to ever use Octane, or other PBR's?  If so, you might consider waiting a couple of months, when the new GTX 2080 is rumored to be coming out.  It is supposed to be similar to the Pascal Titan X, but much less in cost (rumored to be $500).

    But if you want to buy now, you might (at least) consider getting a bigger power supply and case, in the event you want to add or upgrade video cards in the future.  A bigger modular power supply (1000W) is not much more money, and unless you are severly constrained with space, a full-sized case is a no-brainer.

  • cdordonicdordoni Posts: 583
    edited June 2017

    I have mixed feelings about putting in very large power supply. Unless there's a need for multiple very high performance graphics cards, 600W (approx) should be more than enough. Bigger power supply means more heat and more costly in electricity.

    Post edited by cdordoni on
  • 3drendero3drendero Posts: 2,024

    Definately Ryzen, you can see the Cinebench results in all reviews, that more cores means faster renders.

    Cinebench is basically the same as Carrara.

    Just around the corner, is the new workstation Ryzen, the 10-16 core Ryzen Threadripper, rumored to be released Aug 10.

    At a higher cost than Ryzen 8-core, but not like the Intel 10-16 core CPUs that cost as much as a good used car.

    http://wccftech.com/amd-ryzen-threadripper-cpu-launch-august/

  • 3DAGE3DAGE Posts: 3,311

    Hi Andrew :)

    two thoughs,. liquid cooling,.  and,. buy the bit's you really need and throw it together yourself,. (it's really built to be easy to do)

    I've actually never bought a whole computer,. in a box, I've always bought new motherboards processors ram ... etc when i need them, and can justify the cost

    Liquid cooling is something I'm very happy with,.

    With great power comes,.. a lot of heat :)

    Andy :)

  • HeadwaxHeadwax Posts: 9,983

    Hey Wow, ! thanks for all the great advice, cdordoni , 3drendero , , 3DAGE  UnifiedBrain    that sets my mind at rest ;) !

    UnifiedBrain  oh I cant see myself using Octane at the moment. I am a messy kind of renderer :) Thanks for the data on the new card too!

    cdordoni  yes, I can understand concern with the new design _ i noticed one person in the Studio forum with Ryzen not having any joy - where as others were?

    3drendero  thanks for the headsup on the new Threadripper - I have to get this happening by the end of the financial year 10th June :(

    3DAGE  hey Andy, thanks for that advice - to be honest last time I used these people (in Sydney) I approached one of our local builders who told me they couldn't even buy the parts for what the Sydney people charge - but I will look into it , thanks!

     

    One last question I guess

    Would there be any advantage of going with a dual ASUS 8G GeForce GTX 1070 PCI Express rather than a single.?

    I guess that would need a larger power supply?

     

    thanks again

     

    cheers :)

     

     

     

     

     

  • UnifiedBrainUnifiedBrain Posts: 3,588
    edited June 2017

    Considering that you are a professional artist with consumate skill in many styles, I am surprised that Octane (or any other PBR) is not on your list.  It is another tool in the toolbox.

    My understanding (confirmed by Jon Stark) is that the the main value of beefy nVidia cards (like a 1070) is to speed up PBR's, while more CPU cores help in typical workstation tasks (Carrara's native renderer, animation, multitasking).

    In the next few months, I plan on upgrading to a better system.  I will likely not go the i7 route, but will instead build a low cost dual Xeon workstation with a mimimum of 20 cores.  Upcoming Ryzen stuff looks good, but it is too early to tell.

    One thing I forgot to mention was using a solid state drive (SSD) for your program files, and the 2TB drives for storage.  I think that you will find that programs tend to be much zippier when using an SSD.  A good 250GB SSD is only $100 US these days.

    Post edited by UnifiedBrain on
  • HeadwaxHeadwax Posts: 9,983
    edited June 2017

    Thanks UB, those are very kind words. Oh I havnt explored Octane etc because all my time is taken up trying to learn everything all at once and in as many hours in tha day that they aren't :).

     

    Thanks for the other recommendations too.  I'll check out the SSD drive  prices - Aust dollar is usually pretty bad against US dollar at the moment ?

     

    cheers from here ! :)

    Post edited by Headwax on
  • 3DAGE3DAGE Posts: 3,311

    Be wary with SSD ,. some have a very Low re-write quota,.(500)

    All SSD's have a Limit on the ability to write/erase and will eventually stop writing/erasing new data to/from the cels

    They're great for the OS and applications, which are simply stored and read,. but not good for constant write/erase,. tempfiles etc.

    to my mind the speed improvement with SSD ,,..for the price,. is not worth it yet,. prices will come down or the tech will be improved.

    I bought a Seagate "Hybrid" drive  a few years ago,. which has some SSD cels combined with a physical hard drive,. which automatically figures out what should be on SSD (OS apps etc)

    2TB was 180£ (something like that)

    as UB said,. if you're not using a GPU based rendering,. Carrara isn't capable of using the GPU or any of it's Video Ram.

    If you can get "build for you" prices as good as buying the parts,. that's a no brainer,. enjoy the surf :)

     

  • tj_1ca9500btj_1ca9500b Posts: 2,057
    edited June 2017
    3DAGE said:

    Be wary with SSD ,. some have a very Low re-write quota,.(500)

    All SSD's have a Limit on the ability to write/erase and will eventually stop writing/erasing new data to/from the cels

    They're great for the OS and applications, which are simply stored and read,. but not good for constant write/erase,. tempfiles etc.

    to my mind the speed improvement with SSD ,,..for the price,. is not worth it yet,. prices will come down or the tech will be improved.

    I bought a Seagate "Hybrid" drive  a few years ago,. which has some SSD cels combined with a physical hard drive,. which automatically figures out what should be on SSD (OS apps etc)

    2TB was 180£ (something like that)

    as UB said,. if you're not using a GPU based rendering,. Carrara isn't capable of using the GPU or any of it's Video Ram.

    If you can get "build for you" prices as good as buying the parts,. that's a no brainer,. enjoy the surf :)

     

    While you are correct that you should definitely look at SSD endurance ratings when picking a SSD, the fact is that SSDs these days have significantly higher endurance ratings than when they were first introduced, and that it appears that the manufacturers are being rather conservative with their endurance ratings.

    This article is a bit dated, but even in 2014 quality SSD's were acheiving HUGE levels of endurance.

    http://www.pcworld.com/article/2856052/grueling-endurance-test-blows-away-ssd-durability-fears.html,

    While in the early days of SSDs articles used to focus on endurance tests, these days most HDD reviews mention endurance ratings, but don't bother to test that anymore, simply because of the time factor involved (months and months of testing would be needed).  Including storagereview.com, one of my favorite sites to check when I'm shopping for a new drive.

    Here's Google's take on the subject:

    http://www.zdnet.com/article/ssd-reliability-in-the-real-world-googles-experience/

    Short form, according to the Google study, SSD age is the most important factor, not usage.  And while SSDs are less likely to fail, they are more likely to lose bits of data during their lifespan.

    The other takeaway I've seen mentioned in a fewer articles now is that larger SSD's last longer (basically because they rewrite over the same blocks less often, due to the larger number of 'free' blocks available).

    Intel's Optane technology is supposed to have much higher levels of endurance if you are worried about that.  And Optane has other advantages too.

    With that in mind, HDDs and SSDs still occasionally fail for a myriad of reasons, which is why you should always practice the golden rule.  Back up everything onto a separate drive regularly!  And you get what you pay for, so definitely look at the stats when buying, as all HDDs and SSD are not created equal.

    Post edited by tj_1ca9500b on
  • HeadwaxHeadwax Posts: 9,983

    thankyou for the extra advice Andy et tj_1ca9500b  

     

    very interesting links!

     

    :)

     

    ps surf was good :)

  • StezzaStezza Posts: 8,048

    Just come across this thread in the Commons with a system like yours HeadWax

     

    thought it may interest you to make sure you are getting the mostest from your new system... some good tips 

    https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/185681/a-bit-disappointed-with-the-new-supercomputer#latest

  • HeadwaxHeadwax Posts: 9,983

    thanks Stezza, that looks very interesting! should be a good help/

     

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