Daz 3D Introduces dForce Physics Engine

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  • Well this is pretty exciting stuff, in spite of the 90's Saturday morning cartoon inspired name. FEEL THE POWER OF THE DEEEEFORCE! *cue cheesy 90's theme song*

    But I think I will wait for some of the kinks to get worked out. If a 980ti gets blown up by this, then my 970 with its "pitiful" 4 GB will get murdered hard. I have a feeling DForce is going to be rough on older hardware, even very high end stuff.

    I'm running a now anciant 780SC and the few test drapes I've had time to do have worked just fine. I am running a custom Bios on said 780 and full liquid cooling.

  • Luv Lee said:
     

    really--how r u getting hair to work...can u do  a tut..?

    The base of the hair I'm making sure has no influence at all so it's static. Then depending on the hair I expand that. The hair I finally chose has a bit that tucks behind the character's ear. I made sure that whole bit was static so I wouldn't lose the shape. I have one hair I converted that I had the influence go all the way down to the ears.

    No matter if the hair is toon or realistic, they're each modelled to have a certain look so I'm only worried about draping certain parts so it will fall naturally while keeping it's shape anyway.

    If the hair were to need to fall upside down and I had to really restrict it, I'd be a little worried though. I'd have to play with that hair a long time.

     

    Sorry I can't do a tut. For some reason DAZ is only using 10% of my CPU while draping. This may sound wonderful.... over an hour to drape 400 frames. I have no idea how to fix it.

     

  • Oso3DOso3D Posts: 15,009

    What I'm hoping for is some script/function to automatically create a weight map for hair objects, such that one end is at dynamic 0 and then grade over to 100% at some point. That would easily allow the hair to stay anchored and bend rather than flop wildly around the scalp.

     

  • LlynaraLlynara Posts: 4,770
    edited October 2017

    When you are getting consistent mesh explosions no matter what you do check for unused vertices: select the garment then in Geometry Editor mode right click in viewport and select "Remove Unused Vertices"  if there are unused vertices it will tell you how many there are.  Unused vertices will cause a crash/mesh explosion every time.  Please note that if you go ahead and remove those vertices the morphs on that garment will be broken.

    Belle Dress currently has this issue and I am in the process of fixing it, but it will take some time for the product to be updated.  You may have noticed in DIM recently there were updates to some of my store products, those were done to fix exactly this issue so if you are using one of my sets and getting explosions check for DIM updates on it.

    Catching up on thtis thread. Thank you so much Aave, for all the tips here and updating your products to take advantage of the new technology. Love your stuff, and am thrilled to be able to use it with dForce (the built in morphs were already awesome.) I find dForce draped clothing goes so well with your Free Spirit Hair, which I'm having a lot of fun with. I really hope you do more hair!

    I've uploaded a set of scene files to sharecg that provide dForce settings for some of my outfits.  I set up as scene files so that each can act as a mini tutorial!  Just unzip and place the folder in your Daz Library Scene folder. Enjoy playing with dForce!

    https://www.sharecg.com/v/89600/browse/21/DAZ-Studio/Daz-Studio-dForce-settings_Aave-Nainen

    OMG, thank you!!!! 

    ETA: So far I've managed to get Aave's Romance Dress to drape pretty well, along with LilFlame's Dynamic Purity Dress for V4 (made for Poser Clothroom.) I've got a lot of Poser and Optitex stuff to try out. My experiments are on my art forum thread as well as this one.

    Post edited by Llynara on
  • Oso3DOso3D Posts: 15,009

    One of the neat possibilities is products with different dforce options. Think about it.

    Maybe a blouse can have tight cuffs but baggy sleeves. Or fit snugly all around. Or have sleeves that open up toward the cuffs (weightmap). Or...

    Lots of intriguing ways to tweak a single outfit.

     

  • FauvistFauvist Posts: 2,077

    Does this mean we can use the Dynamic Cloth clothing made for Poser in Daz Studio?

  • Fauvist said:

    Does this mean we can use the Dynamic Cloth clothing made for Poser in Daz Studio?

     

    I confess I've not had any success with any of those ones.

  • Oso3DOso3D Posts: 15,009

    I would expect that anything you can convert to an obj should work... though it might not be welded correctly/etc.

    One thing I'm hoping we see is some way to set up a 'stickiness' value so that stuff is a little less likely to go pwoof.

     

  • scorpioscorpio Posts: 8,414
    Fauvist said:

    Does this mean we can use the Dynamic Cloth clothing made for Poser in Daz Studio?

     

    I confess I've not had any success with any of those ones.

    Yes the couple I've tried worked pretty well. See this thread

    https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/203671/let-s-see-your-dforce-renders-experiments-interesting-results#latest

  • I would expect that anything you can convert to an obj should work... though it might not be welded correctly/etc.

    One thing I'm hoping we see is some way to set up a 'stickiness' value so that stuff is a little less likely to go pwoof.

     

    You can already do this to an extent by limiting the effect of the simulation on separate parts of the clothing items after applying the dForce modifier. There are a lot of features in there that we need to learn, and make sure get properly documented.

  • FauvistFauvist Posts: 2,077

    What happens when you try to morph the figure inside the clothing?  Does the clothing automatically alter to match the morph like it does in Poser?

  • QuasarQuasar Posts: 638
    Fauvist said:

    What happens when you try to morph the figure inside the clothing?  Does the clothing automatically alter to match the morph like it does in Poser?

    Yes, even after the draping simulation.

  • Fauvist said:

    What happens when you try to morph the figure inside the clothing?  Does the clothing automatically alter to match the morph like it does in Poser?

    if it's fitted clothing it will follow the morph (assuming that isn't deliberately blocked). If you want the drape to adapt to the new shape you will have to rerun it.

  • FauvistFauvist Posts: 2,077

    Could someone test it on a MAC - especially running 10.6.8?  I haven't been able to even upgrade to Studio 4.9 because the installer gets stuck, and if I download it automatically the iRay doesn't work.  Just so everyone knows - APPLE isn't using NVIDIA  cards in any of their new computers.
     

  • Fauvist said:

    Could someone test it on a MAC - especially running 10.6.8?  I haven't been able to even upgrade to Studio 4.9 because the installer gets stuck, and if I download it automatically the iRay doesn't work.  Just so everyone knows - APPLE isn't using NVIDIA  cards in any of their new computers.
     

    Apple's lack of support for nVidia video cards is irrelevant to dForce as it doesn't depend on CUDA or any nVidia specific technology. And I believe some folks here that have posted have been using it on Mac OS X.

  • Luv LeeLuv Lee Posts: 230
    Luv Lee said:
     

    really--how r u getting hair to work...can u do  a tut..?

    The base of the hair I'm making sure has no influence at all so it's static. Then depending on the hair I expand that. The hair I finally chose has a bit that tucks behind the character's ear. I made sure that whole bit was static so I wouldn't lose the shape. I have one hair I converted that I had the influence go all the way down to the ears.

    No matter if the hair is toon or realistic, they're each modelled to have a certain look so I'm only worried about draping certain parts so it will fall naturally while keeping it's shape anyway.

    If the hair were to need to fall upside down and I had to really restrict it, I'd be a little worried though. I'd have to play with that hair a long time.

     

    Sorry I can't do a tut. For some reason DAZ is only using 10% of my CPU while draping. This may sound wonderful.... over an hour to drape 400 frames. I have no idea how to fix it.

     

    So you make the scalp  or cap static and then drape from that point?   I will try to experiment  with it a bit -- thank you :-)

  • Luv LeeLuv Lee Posts: 230
    Fauvist said:

    Does this mean we can use the Dynamic Cloth clothing made for Poser in Daz Studio?

     

    I have used poser stuff--but you kinda of have to shape it to fit the figure via scaling as DForce doesn't accomodate for holes in the mesh the way VWD does...

     

  • fixmypcmikefixmypcmike Posts: 19,583
    Fauvist said:

    Could someone test it on a MAC - especially running 10.6.8?  I haven't been able to even upgrade to Studio 4.9 because the installer gets stuck, and if I download it automatically the iRay doesn't work.  Just so everyone knows - APPLE isn't using NVIDIA  cards in any of their new computers.
     

    dForce requires OpenCL 1.2; as stated in the *dForce - Start Here* thread (https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/203081#dependencies)

    OS X 10.6.8 (Snow Leopard) doesn't support OpenCL 1.2; support stops at 1.1.

     

  • Luv Lee said:
     

    So you make the scalp  or cap static and then drape from that point?   I will try to experiment  with it a bit -- thank you :-)

    The scalp ANd any part that's the hair coming out of the head. Here's hoping you succeed.

     

  • sapatsapat Posts: 1,735

    Maybe I've missed it somewhere, but how can we set the pose at say frame 15 and then let the sim run for 30+ frames to let the cloth 'settle' like we did in Poser? I've never used the timeline in DS and have no idea how to set up this type of animation in here.

    Also, where are the links to the test files ppl were downloading?  Some kind of sample sim with a garment?  I can't find that either? 

    And lastly, I really was hoping there was something simple like pins to hold things in place.  I am not a super user and find all this 'painting' to be cumbersome.

    thank you.

  • In the simulation tab, turn on "start bones from memorized pose". Very  handy, but be careful. I had everything in my scene draped byt ONE thing... even with sim freeze on... I lost all my drapings. Took me days to get that far and I had to start over because I realized it AFTER I'd saved.

  • Luv LeeLuv Lee Posts: 230
    Luv Lee said:
     

    So you make the scalp  or cap static and then drape from that point?   I will try to experiment  with it a bit -- thank you :-)

    The scalp ANd any part that's the hair coming out of the head. Here's hoping you succeed.

     

    Thank you so much!!!

  • heavenleedesignsheavenleedesigns Posts: 5
    edited October 2017

    Hi Guys,

                 When i try 2 start simulation, i get an error message saying it can't find valid OpenCL device, how can i fix this? I have up 2 date drivers n still no simulation xxxxx

    Post edited by heavenleedesigns on
  • SpottedKittySpottedKitty Posts: 7,232

    When i try 2 start simulation, i get an error message saying it can't find valid OpenCL device, how can i fix this? I have up 2 date drivers n still no simulation

    Up to date drivers for what? This isn't the same as your graphics card drivers, OpenCL is a separate thing altogether. There are different versions to install depending on exactly what hardware's in your computer, so do a Google search on "OpenCL" and look for downloads matching your hardware.

    Also note that you must have OpenCL1.2 — the older 1.1 version doesn't work for dForce.

  • Just stumbled on this thread... Great news smiley - I actually hadn't expected physics before DS5 ! cool

     

    So I hope 4.10 will work better for me than 4.9.4.122 - which does most things alright, but crashes for me after every render... frown

     

    Well, atleast it waits until I saved the render, but always needing to restart after rendering definitely is somewhat annoying - and that the rendering takes quite long because I'm unfortunately still limited to my CPU's graphic [Intel HD4000] doesn't really help either. ( I know Ishould get a new GPU, but exchanging them in laptops isn't quite easy, if even possible frown - and my desktop seems to have mainboard-issues sad )

    Ok, maybe that will make using dForce problematic, too, but at least I know it's there. smiley

     

  • ZilvergrafixZilvergrafix Posts: 1,385

    We need a mesh welder too!!

  • Up to date drivers for what? This isn't the same as your graphics card drivers, OpenCL is a separate thing altogether. There are different versions to install depending on exactly what hardware's in your computer, so do a Google search on "OpenCL" and look for downloads matching your hardware.

    Also note that you must have OpenCL1.2 — the older 1.1 version doesn't work for dForce.

    I just found this after I've been trying to find an answer to my problem, which is that my only open CL options are my two video cards in my advanced tab. I'm given to understand (and I could be wrong) that in the advanced tab I MIGHT be able to tell it to use my CPU. Maybe? A littler layman's talk clarity would be much appreciated because I'm not kidding. All official documentation I'm finding so far makes less sense than Madarin. Alhough I admit I did study Mandarin a while.

    I know my Google-foo is weak and I can't find things other people find easily... But after updating my card drivers I literally have no clue what I'm supposed to find next!

    What I DO see in Google are a bunch of developer forum threads about it... which are all over my head of course.

     

  • Up to date drivers for what? This isn't the same as your graphics card drivers, OpenCL is a separate thing altogether. There are different versions to install depending on exactly what hardware's in your computer, so do a Google search on "OpenCL" and look for downloads matching your hardware.

    Also note that you must have OpenCL1.2 — the older 1.1 version doesn't work for dForce.

    I just found this after I've been trying to find an answer to my problem, which is that my only open CL options are my two video cards in my advanced tab. I'm given to understand (and I could be wrong) that in the advanced tab I MIGHT be able to tell it to use my CPU. Maybe? A littler layman's talk clarity would be much appreciated because I'm not kidding. All official documentation I'm finding so far makes less sense than Madarin. Alhough I admit I did study Mandarin a while.

    I know my Google-foo is weak and I can't find things other people find easily... But after updating my card drivers I literally have no clue what I'm supposed to find next!

    What I DO see in Google are a bunch of developer forum threads about it... which are all over my head of course.

    See the Start Here thread:

    Are there any dependencies that I need to be aware of?

    Yes, there is. The dForce engine utilizes OpenCL 1.2 to perform simulations. If you do not have a driver already installed that supports at least OpenCL 1.2, you will need to install one. The more recent driver packages from NVIDIA and AMD typically include a suitable driver. In the case of older cards (e.g., GTS 250), the NVIDIA drivers do not support OpenCL 1.2 and so the driver for the CPU must be installed:

    Intel GPU/CPU Driver Packages

    Intel CPU-only Runtime Packages

    You may want to install the CPU driver anyway if you want/need to be able to use your CPU for running simulations.

  • BeeMKayBeeMKay Posts: 7,019
    edited October 2017

    Short feedback on my Miss Fisher's Exploding Wardrobe Experience... updating to the Version 110 released a few days ago solved most of the crash and explode problems.

    Happily experimenting away now, and I'm getting good results even with Self Collision. In addition, the simulation, which bowed out of the graphiccard before, now runs there very smoothly. Thumbs up from me, well done, DAZzlers! heart

    (And I really love Miss Fishers Non-Exploding Wardrobe! smileyheart)

    Post edited by BeeMKay on
  • marblemarble Posts: 7,500
    BeeMKay said:

    Short feedback on my Miss Fisher's Exploding Wardrobe Experience... updating to the Version 110 released a few days ago solved most of the crash and explode problems.

    Happily experimenting away now, and I'm getting good results even with Self Collision. In addition, the simulation, which bowed out of the graphiccard before, now runs there very smoothly. Thumbs up from me, well done, DAZzlers! heart

    (And I really love Miss Fishers Non-Exploding Wardrobe! smileyheart)

    Well isn't it strange how people's experience differs? I also updated the beta a few days ago and found that it made all my problems worse. Still getting explosions (more so, if fact) and right now I don't have a single completed simulation from the updated beta. I have not tried Miss Fisher though - I don't have that wardrobe. 

    In the end, I have uninstalled the 4.10 beta and will wait until a stable version is released. In my experience, this software is far too immature and will take a long time before it becomes a part of my workflow. When it gains features such as interactive adjustments it will start to challenge the third party solutions such as VWD (which also crashes a lot) and Marvelous Designer (which is truly marvelous but so, so expensive).

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