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Modeling Challenge (request)

3dOutlaw3dOutlaw Posts: 2,471
edited December 1969 in Hexagon Discussion

So, I know when I've been beat, and Hex beat me trying to make this morph on A4. I am trying to make a morph that is an Anime/Manga nose. No Nostril, and just pointy. There are plenty of examples out there.

Here is one: LINK

Here is another: LINK

Anyone up to the challenge? I would appreciate it, I was unable to do it (trying to remove the nostril...just could not do it) :(

Comments

  • RoygeeRoygee Posts: 2,247
    edited December 1969

    Hi there :)

    Something like this?

    I symmetry mode, select one vert deep in the nostril and expand the selection until all nostril verts are selected. Make the size in the properties panel 0 in all axes - that will collapse all the verts to one point. Move the point to be flush with the nose, then using soft selection, make the nose pointy. Give it a light brush with the soften tool to even out any creases.

    aiko.jpg
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  • 3dOutlaw3dOutlaw Posts: 2,471
    edited December 1969

    Yes, that is the idea, but isn't it a no-no to change the number of vertices in the model for a morph? (when you collapse to one point above) Could I do what you said, and save that back to DS as a morph on A4? I was trying to avoid that, as I have often run into using a modified OBJ as a morph target, and DS complaining that the number of vertices does not match.

  • JimmyC_2009JimmyC_2009 Posts: 8,891
    edited December 1969

    Yes, you CANNOT change the vertex count, or the vertex order if you want to create a morph in DS. DS uses the original mesh as a template, and then it knows where to move each vertex in 3D space to match the required morph. If any vertices are missing, it can't do that.

  • 3dOutlaw3dOutlaw Posts: 2,471
    edited December 1969

    So in the example above, the "collapse" would change the vertex count, right? ...or does it just stack all vertex' on the same point, and I need to be careful not to weld them together?

  • JimmyC_2009JimmyC_2009 Posts: 8,891
    edited December 1969

    So in the example above, the “collapse” would change the vertex count, right?


    No the count will remain the same, it is safe to do it this way I think, no welding of course :)
  • 3dOutlaw3dOutlaw Posts: 2,471
    edited December 1969

    Cool! OK, thanks Roygee and JimmyC_2009, I will give this another go, now that I have these great tips!

  • 3dOutlaw3dOutlaw Posts: 2,471
    edited December 1969

    One more question, which I have been working around...is there a way to set the view to rotate around a vertice? In this cae, since I am so zoomed in to grab and modify vertices, the view rotation really needs to rotate around the point I have selected.

  • JimmyC_2009JimmyC_2009 Posts: 8,891
    edited December 1969

    From the manual:

    Combine the shortcuts Alt + CTRL and the left mouse button to rotate the camera
    around the current selection (object, vertices, edges or faces). You can choose the mode
    as default by changing the preference “Dolly Around Selection”, in the “User Interface”
    tab, under section “Misc”.

    It does work well as far as I can remember.

  • 3dOutlaw3dOutlaw Posts: 2,471
    edited December 1969

    OK, I was looking in the wrong sections (Control Panel, and centering tools), looking for a menu option for it. I did not think to look in the Mouse Nav remarks. This works perfect though, thanks!

  • 3dOutlaw3dOutlaw Posts: 2,471
    edited December 1969

    Is there a "zone" around the symmaetry line that will pull close vertices onto that line? Here at two pics, one is selecting all of the vertices, and then the second is when I set one of the "size" to 0. You can see 3 vertices "snap" to the symmetry line. This happens not only when I do this, but when I even touch that selection of vertices. I searched through the manual relating to symmetry modes, but I don't see anything about turning that off?

    Nostril3.jpg
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    Nostril2.jpg
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  • RoygeeRoygee Posts: 2,247
    edited December 1969

    You need to set all the axes to 0 before seeing the proper change. As Jimmy has pointed out, the verts collapse to a single point in 3D space, but they are all still there and the count doesn't change - I've tested and Studio accepts the change as a morph.

    This is the standard method of making earless morphs.

  • 3dOutlaw3dOutlaw Posts: 2,471
    edited December 1969

    I did try before replying it was just easier to see without doing all axes, see below...those three collapse to one but still seperate from the group, snapped to the line, and you can see those three over on the right as well...

    Nostril4.jpg
    927 x 413 - 109K
  • 3dOutlaw3dOutlaw Posts: 2,471
    edited December 1969

    Argh! I completely reloaded and reselected from scratch and those 3 point still snap to the line. There must be some setting that I am missing..?

    Nostril5.jpg
    1176 x 676 - 199K
  • JimmyC_2009JimmyC_2009 Posts: 8,891
    edited December 1969

    The only thing I can think of, is the Snap to Grid function as shown below. If you unselect that, does it still snap?

    Untitled-1.jpg
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  • 3dOutlaw3dOutlaw Posts: 2,471
    edited February 2014

    No, that is not selected.

    I am surprised this has not happened to anyone before. Its easy to do. Load any OBJ of V4 or A4, etc. Click the Symmetry X button, select a vertice that is 1 vertices away from the symmetry line (it basically cuts right thru the middle set of vertices, so select a vertice next to that), the grab the manipulator and try and move it. On mine, it immediately snaps to the symmetry line...and I can't pull it off.

    Its a nice feature when you want it (i.e. making something where you want the vertices to stack in the middle, and you will weld them) I am just thinking there must be a way to turn it off...in cases where you dont want it to happen.

    (on a side note, it appears V4's nostrils are just far enough away, this doesn't occur, so I am working with that)

    Post edited by 3dOutlaw on
  • 3dOutlaw3dOutlaw Posts: 2,471
    edited December 1969

    So here is my first outcome...this is using a shader without a map, as I thought that would address the stretched UV issue, but I guess not.

    I assume I will need to not stretch the mesh so mush when I do this, and just make a really small point where they are stacked...so that it is less noticeable?

    Nostril6.jpg
    387 x 421 - 16K
  • RoygeeRoygee Posts: 2,247
    edited February 2014

    re your previous post - just tested on a very dense mesh - I don't get any snapping to the centre line...

    You shouldn't be getting the pinching - have you tried giving it a light brush with the smoothing tool?

    PS - another though - you have possibly gone too far to the outside of the nostril with the selection?

    Post edited by Roygee on
  • 3dOutlaw3dOutlaw Posts: 2,471
    edited February 2014

    Hi Roygee,

    I appreciate the help. There must be a setting that is on for me, off for you. It happens on any mesh I try, if I am too close to that line.

    I did use the soften tool, and it helped the right nostril, but the left pushed up and in when I used it >:(

    I tried different things for a while yesterday, then I gave up and bought Anime Doll for $5 and am going to use that (works well, see below)

    I do appreciate your help though!

    (Note: Anime Doll head on A4 body)

    AnimeDoll_th.jpg
    306 x 408 - 26K
    Post edited by 3dOutlaw on
  • RoygeeRoygee Posts: 2,247
    edited December 1969

    Win some, loose some - sorry it didn't work for you, but you have a nice new purchase to play with :)

    I can't imagine or find any setting that would cause the verts to snap like that!

    The thing with the smoothing tool is to use small settings and use it very gently and conservatively, or you get the result you describe.

  • 3dOutlaw3dOutlaw Posts: 2,471
    edited December 1969

    I tried again on A3, and actually got a decent morph! Bad thing is, I cannot now get it to save as anything usable in Daz Studio. In DS it is a Morph, that I can dial up or down, but I have tried to save as a deprecated Poser Preset and a deprecated character preset, and neither do anything if I fire up a new DS, load A3 and try and apploy them... :(

    Any thoughts?

  • RoygeeRoygee Posts: 2,247
    edited December 1969

    Sorry, mate - can't help there:)

    II tried, saved the .dsa file in several locations, can locate them, but can't get them to load.

    Studio is pretty much a closed book to me since they went .duf - I only keep it because it is needed for characters to work correctly in Carrara :)

    I see there's another thread here about this - maybe someone can come up with an answer!

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