Legality of making props of existing commercial devices
Hello!
I'm not holding anyone responsible for the replies. ;-)
Does anyone knows about the legality of making 3D props of existing, real devices (for example, a specific computer, phone or any other electronic device)? My questions are:
- Would it be legal to give it for free?
- And to sell it here, for example?
- If it wouldn't be legal, what if I don't use any logos or brand names anywhere, but the 3D model emulates exactly a distinctive product?
Thanks!
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Comments
If it really looks like an identifiable product, ask the owner of the product ;-)
1. If the design is unique enough, maybe for making fan art
2. Probably not based on some previous products that were butchered to make them not look like their real world counterparts
3. No way any real logos and/or brand names could be used, no matter if given for free or sold.
Not feasible :-)
Yeah, just like I thought. I've seen lots and lots of perfect copies around (like cars, for example) of real-world products, and I'm certain they don't have the permission from the brand. I've even seen people selling 3D models of real world products citing the name, so I thought that maybe things could be different...
My idea was to share, for free, some models I created (share the OBJ files with textures and all). A few people tought the renders were real pictures, so I thought it would be a good thing to share, but I'll keep them for myself to stay on the safe side. Maybe they will show up in some of my future renders. :-)
Thanks!
You mention of things like computers, those manufacturers have way more money than we do, is it really worth the risk? And no, Daz3D is not likely going to sell any close calls for copyrighted/trademarked materials. They treasure their business ;-)
When we see identifiable products in movies for example, all those companies [as far as I know] have PAID to have their products advertized in said movies.
A book is a book. One can make a computer that doesn't look like a specific brand belonging to any company.
Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer, I am just sharing some ideas from things I've read over the years. For best advice, consult a lawyer where you live.
Especially cars are something they don't seem to like.
One has a large selection of characters, clothing, environments which could create the illusion for being real photos, but when it comes to vehicles, you get https://www.daz3d.com/blue-mamba or https://www.daz3d.com/gangster-car
Other shops do have realistic cars, so maybe their policy is different for other things as well (as long as no real logos or brand names are used)
Oh they've got these cars, but no location brands ;-) https://www.daz3d.com/police-vehicles-bundle
I agree with you wholehearted. :-) My question about selling the models was only an add-on, I was not thinking about it (my idea was to release the model for free) exactly because it isn't worth the risk. :-)
Thank you all for the inputs!
To be clear: my idea was to release the model for free, not sell it. :-) I asked about selling because I've seen (in other sites) people selling 3D models of real cars for example, and I'm sure they don't have the permission from the manufacturer to sell a 3D model for $25 :-) . It was out of curiosity only. Yes, I think about selling models in the future, but certainly not real-world copies.
About these specific models: as I said above, I'll sadly keep them to myself. I'm really wanting to give something back to the community (not only Daz, but including Daz) because I've benefited so much from the tutorials, forum posts, etc. After three different people mistook my model for the real thing, I thought about it, but logic seemed to suggest it was not legal to do so. You confirmed it. :-)
I'll do something else and release for free as a small, humble but sincere token of gratitude. :-)
Thanks again!
I have that bundle. Nice, but I wish that the sedan and pickup had back doors. Polish also did these: Upper Class Vehicle Bundle | Daz 3D It't pretty clear what brands they are based on.
The thing I've seen that surprised me the most is a set of shelves from Ikea that I actually have in my house. The object is identical to the real item, though I don't think anyone would know unless they actually own the shelves. Which probably means the PA owns a set...
If it does not have 4 doors it is not a sedan.
To have people mistaking your models for the real thing is quite the compliment! I'm not that good yet ;-)
Free is generally safer than selling BUT not necessarily so. I'm thinking of various models people have been releasing for sale and free concerning a certain "fanart" topic ... the company owning the rights is into "everything" with their products. While many of us only use the models for 2D prints, we have to remember that the 3D models technically could be used for 3D printing, games, etc. and that's a whole other world. One company went "for blood" when they decided to crack down. Perceived monies lost, court costs, the whole shebang. And I've seen posts where modelers were helping each other to stay safe too cautioning people to "keep their working files" -- situations being there that if 2 people model the same thing, the models look alike, did one steal from the other? Court proof required working files. And I had to laugh when examining one guy's model, he sticks a little butterfly inside his sphere. If what I'm making is basically just a sphere, I just give it away, anybody can make a sphere.
Having been involved in making fanart models, I really listened to that inner sense watching what was going on. It's an interesting world ... maybe it involved different factions of a company, I'm not sure ... but they seemingly allowed all kinds of fanart for characters "A through to Y" but don't anybody dare do "Z." All kinds of fanart stuff for "Z" would be pulled left right and centre.
I know he is not selling the "things" directly (mostly furniture), but the "Blender Guru" uses real-world products in his videos all the time. He has even stated that he prefers to use brands that give the "plans" (top, front and side views) of the items with measures, so he can copy them perfectly. He also suggests people can use this method to create 3D items for their projects or even to sell.
Specific examples (among several others): https://youtu.be/Y4whyFTilsA?t=88 , https://youtu.be/KyXRBu7gn2o?t=101 , https://youtu.be/WVr4fPFUr2E?t=84 , https://youtu.be/Hf2esGA7vCc?t=142
In the first video he even talks about "creating the couch and selling it online".
Again, I agree that this cannot be OK in terms of copyright, but together with the bunch of models of real, branded things I've seen around as free or even "to sell" 3D models, I tend to think this is pretty common (what does not mean I'm going to do it, as the risk is far, far greater than the benefit).
About the model that people mistook for the real thing: it's a one-off for now. ;-) It's not a really complex object (an electronic device), and the textures (free ones) I've used were so perfect for the job that it really looked "alive". But I'm a beginner yet, I'm learning a lot from you guys.
I agree with you about the risks (and this is why I'm refraining from sharing my work), especially for me, for whom the 3D is still a hobby and whose food comes from my day job. Now, for people that live from the 3D models they create it's more complicated, as it's almost impossible to create something that was not done before. All the couches, chairs, lamps have some resemblance between them... Where does it become "copying"? Hard to say.
Fanart... Now this is another beast entirely. I'm a Trekker, and there was a FANTASTIC fanfic recreation of The Original Series called Star Trek Continues ( https://www.startrekcontinues.com/episodes.html ) that, at first, flew under the very powerful radar of the right's owners. The problem was that the series was so, so good, and its scripts had so much in common with the real ToS spirit (unlike the crappy action movies and series that are done today under the guise of being "Star Trek") that it became a hit. Lots of people watched it and, although they released the "episodes" for free, they were crowdfunded and almost everyone, from the actors to the technical crew, were paid for it. It became a semi-commercial franchise, but without the proper licenses.
At some point the rights' owners (instead of hiring the ST-Continues team to create a new series for cable that, paired with a decent budget, would probably be a hit) decided to crack down, but knowing the Trek community they were careful enough to establish guidelines (limit the time to any fanfic to a ridiculously short duration, prohibiting sequels, etc) that made the series unpractical but were not an express prohibition, and to ask politely to the ST Continues team to stop without any legal action. The ST-Continues team released one last episode and stopped and everyone got home safely, but it was a huge risk.
So, fanart is always very close to disaster. :-) I have HUGE respect for everyone that create them, for sometimes they are more real than the newer installments of the franchise but even so they are risking their finances for free.
The situation there involved court, and everybody I think suspects it had a lot to do with a planned new release which did happen with a new ST series coming on [which I can't get here].
About couches etc., yes, a book is a book is a book. And one normally uses something for reference, decent blueprints are wonderful if you can find them BUT, like with clothing even, it's the "designer" models to be more careful about. The designer's copyright or whatever their designs. Cloth makers do too. But a poka dot is a poka dot.
I haven't got a piece of "real ST" cloth to check this, but allegedly if one has it, and a microscope, the V logo, is repeated down and down and down through the cloth. Pretty amazing if it's true.