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Testing hair with Diffeomorphic 1.6.2 and problems with hair shine

camilocamilo Posts: 15
edited December 2022 in Blender Discussion

I did a simple test with Diffeomporphic 1.6.2 and default options with some hairs. The ones I tested are, from top to bottom:

https://www.daz3d.com/3-in-1-low-ponytails-hair-for-genesis-8-and-81-females

https://www.daz3d.com/rose-hair-for-genesis-3-and-8-females

https://www.daz3d.com/amelia-hair-for-genesis-8-females

https://www.daz3d.com/fe-short-hair-vol-1-for-genesis-8-male-and-female

First column is the render on DAZ, second column is Diffeomorphic importing with BSDF option and third one with Principled shader. I also enabled SSS Skin and SSS Fix.

Two of the hairs belong to outoftouch and I found some good comments about their hairs, but the Principled shader works really badly with them. Also, the node setup for 3-in-1 Low Ponytails Hair missed some nodes and textures, see the attached image.

Notice also that all the hairs are shiny on DAZ and the one that looks more natural is the first one, the others look a bit exaggerated, but all of them look flat on Blender.  I tried to fix it without success, anyone knows how to fix it and make them a bit shiny?

Diffeomorphic version: 1.6.2.1263

Hairs.jpg
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Nodes.jpg
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Post edited by camilo on

Comments

  • PadonePadone Posts: 3,688

    OOT uses his own custom shaders that are not supported by diffeomorphic. You can try by converting to uber before exporting (just apply the uber shader).

  • artisanhaven00artisanhaven00 Posts: 5

    Yeah same question as OP. Just need a method to make the hairs a bit more shiny/glossy. Anyone got any good custom shader setups for that or any advice?  I really don't wanna use particle hair even tho there is an exceptional hair converter by Cinus, cause with the standard imported hair I can just use the bones to move parts or import custom morphs for shaping/adjusting much easier than having to comb or rig particle hair. 

    Also side question, any particlar reason when importing a pose into blender using the daz library why does the character have to move back to world orgin with the newly imported pose? Is there a way to stop that or is that just how it has to work?

  • PadonePadone Posts: 3,688

     

    @artisanhaven00 As for the hair material you can import as bsdf or principled then ajust the specularity as you wish of course, I don't see what's the problem with that. As for loading a pose I can confirm the issue and it's reported to Thomas.

    https://bitbucket.org/Diffeomorphic/import_daz/issues/1286/

  • artisanhaven00artisanhaven00 Posts: 5
    edited December 2022

    @camilo OK so found this a while back and forgot about it, it's basically a reduced version of the standard diffeo setup. Still playing around with it but got a bit of sheen on an OOT hair.. Probably should do some more tweaking like deleting a few random stands and probably adjusting the transparency max bounces and some of nodes values a bit but it does the trick a lil I suppose. Should work wonders on non OOT hairs or hairs that are brighter coloured. 

    @Padone Thank you, was contemplating making a bitbuct acc to make reports. My only other bug is I can't scan the morph database for the genesis 3 female morphs. I can scan for the others just fine but when I scan for G3F it starts and then at some point it just gets stopped I suppose it might be some morph or something but I'm no expert. Sorry I know this isn't the thread for this just thought I might point this one out as well while I was at it. 

    Hair Shader.png
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    Full Hair.png
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    Screenshot_1.png
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    Post edited by artisanhaven00 on
  • camilocamilo Posts: 15
    edited December 2022

    I found that the key to that hair shine is the Anisotropic BSDF Shader. You'll find it inside DAZ Glossy and DAZ Top Coat node groups and as part of Principled BSDF. The problem is that the shader does some calculations based on normals and the imported node setup overexaggerates the normals with the bump node. Probably DAZ mixes normal and bump textures in a different way. I just disabled two bump nodes that connect to DAZ Glossy and DAZ Top Coat and increased a bit the color on the DAZ Glossy node and it did the trick. Check the attached image, from left to right: original image on Blender, after disabling bump node, after increasing color on DAZ Glossy node and original DAZ image. Didn't test it yet, but I think the best solution is just to discard bump maps on DAZ before importing.

    Hair fix.jpg
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    Nodes fix.jpg
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    Post edited by camilo on
  • artisanhaven00artisanhaven00 Posts: 5
    edited December 2022

    Yeah looks like bump is affecting the stuff, I did also play around with a few values in the dual lobe, glossy and top coat nodes a bit. 1st is the original in daz and then default blender then tweaked default. 

    Daz OG.png
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    BD.png
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    BR.png
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    Post edited by artisanhaven00 on
  • PadonePadone Posts: 3,688
    edited December 2022

    Yes the anisotropic effect is different in iray and cycles, and it is also different in blender between bsdf and principled. So it is approximated and may need some adjustement.

    note. If you use 3delight hair for G3 you need to convert to iray uber before exporting to get the anisotropic conversion, since 3delight shaders are supported only for the basic features.

    Post edited by Padone on
  • artisanhaven00artisanhaven00 Posts: 5
    edited December 2022

    @Padone regarding the pose issue it seems for the pose to be imported without the character being returned to world orgin all I needed to do was set the Object Transformations Affect to NONE.
    *Facepalm* 
    So that's all good now. So I guess only the scanned database G3F morph issue is my only problem left.

    Import Pose.jpg
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    Post edited by artisanhaven00 on
  • PadonePadone Posts: 3,688
    edited December 2022

    Yes I updated the pose issue, imo it should work with transform = object too but we'll see what Thomas replies.

    As for the scanned database your description is too generic I can't tell anything unless you provide exact steps possibly with pictures and a a test scene for reference. Better if you do it in the diffeomorphic repository for Thomas to look at since I'm really no expert with the database. I don't use the database myself, the plugin can work perfectly fine without.

    The database is only needed to "bake" expression morphs to poses, that may be useful or not depending how you work. In my very own opinion this optimization is not worth the hassle of having to scan and maintain a database. Unless I miss something that is entirely possible.

    https://bitbucket.org/Diffeomorphic/import_daz/issues

    Post edited by Padone on
  • artisanhaven00artisanhaven00 Posts: 5

    Yeah thanks for the feedback. The addon does work just fine without having to use the scanned database so it's not a big issue for me either since I also noticed I don't really need to use it atm. I'll drop a report if I come to the realization that I may need it but I guess it's fine atm as is :) 
    Also if anyone else has come up with a another hair shader or method pls share still not done searching for hair perfection!

  • VanillaStuffVanillaStuff Posts: 21

    Make sure to increase the transparency bounces from 8 to 32. Then the hair will also look better. Might not the shiny issue, but you will notice the hair looks less clumpy. More like single hair fibers. 

  • ProspectorProspector Posts: 54

    have a diffiomorphic problem that i could find nothing about so maby i can find help here.importing daz model works fine UNTILL i make a MHX rig. BOoM.... all hair bones go away. on some hair sets the import comes completely bald...no hair at at all. What buttons should I set ?? thanks in advance.

  • PadonePadone Posts: 3,688

    The hair bones in mhx should be in the custom layer. The bald figure is probably from dforce hair, in daz studio you need to set some tessellation to bake the viewport, then in blender you need to convert to particles.

    https://bitbucket.org/Diffeomorphic/import_daz/wiki/Setup/Hair

     

  • ProspectorProspector Posts: 54

    will try and find some vids for that. Just started blender so gotta learn.

    Thanks for the direction too look.

  • ProspectorProspector Posts: 54
    edited October 2023

    found hair bones but not moving hair with wiggle 2. guess its weights ??

    Post edited by Prospector on
  • ProspectorProspector Posts: 54

    Been 10 days of experimenting. Just can't get wiggle bones 2 to work in blender on hair. If I bring in just hair it works fine. Cant get 1 object (hair and charerctor)to come in as 1 object all parented correctly. As seperate objects they will not let me choose bones in each object to parent. Will try to make 1 object in daz I guess.

     

    there must be a way to do this...

  • PadonePadone Posts: 3,688

    Use easy import with the defult options, the armatures will be automatically merged this way and that's how the daz figures are supposed to work in blender, keeping separate armatures isn't any good. As for wiggle if the bones are driven with daz morphs then you can't move them in blender, again use easy import with default options to get all bones posable by default.

    In general if you're new to blender/daz then use easy import to simplify the process for thngs you don't understand, that's what it's for.

    https://bitbucket.org/Diffeomorphic/import_daz/wiki/Import/Easy Import DAZ

    Or describe the exact steps to reproduce the issue if you believe there's a bug.

    https://bitbucket.org/Diffeomorphic/import_daz/issues

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