Why my renders are so noisy ?
mike_disc
Posts: 64
Hi all !
Since the beginning that i'm using Daz, each image render shows noise.
Here is a sample on a render (HD 720p) of skin, i'm using render default settings
What settings could solve that issue ?
Thanks a lot
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Your image doesn't load.
But when you look in your log (Help > Troubleshooting > View Log File) what is then the criteria for that it stops.
There is the possibility that it drops to CPU, and don't finish the render as it reaches the end of the time criteria.
Hi @felis, yes the render has ended correctly (after 2 hours).
What is the setting to the render time ?
The time is in Render Settings > Progressive Render. If you set it to 0 it will not use time as a stop criteria.
But rendering on GPU is much faster than CPU, but that requires an NVidia GPU with enough VRAM to contain the scene.
What GPU do you have?
Also, make sure that you have enough light in your scene. Too little light will increase render time significantly.
OK here is below my config :
That does not list your GPU (Graphic Processer Unit).
If you in Daz Studio go into Render Settings > Advanced does it then list any GPU?
Also, Help>Troubleshooting>About Your Video Card...
I think that it's Nvidia RTX3070 but I think that's a only 8GO card it seems to be a little bit too low...
Yes, 8 GB is enough for some things, but can easily run out of memery if not careful.
Some sets uses many high res textures, and characters with high subD will also require a lot.
You can try hide things not in view of the camera, as well as parts of characters that is covered with clothing.
What do you have in yout scene?
I have already remove lot of things in my scene.
I have 2 characters, 1 chair, 1 rug, 1 floor, 4 walls, 1 ceilling few other stuffs and scene is very lighted.
I've installed Scene optimizer and renders are now faster but noise is still there and i can see spot lights like shown here (on the lips) and i don't know why...
Are you deleting your images after you upload them?
If so they might be visible for you, but not for others.
You can check in your log if your GPU runs out of memory, so you are using CPU to render.
Don't delete the attachments after putting a link in the body of your post - that is al it is, a link, and anyone who comes along later will not have a cached copy and so will see only a broken image marker (do a froced-refresh, something like ctrl shift r, to see for youself)..
Here are the spots lights, but i've increased the render quality (=>set as 4) and seems that it has been desapears
Here is the noise on final render
How are you lightning your scene, and how many iterations are done when it finishes?
Lights are from the outside (windows) and with "pendants lights" in the room.
How can I check the iterations numbers ?
You can check iterations in your log (Help > Troublshooting > View Log File). It will also say how much the image is converged.
2023-10-07 23:22:17.652 Iray [INFO] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.0 IRAY rend progr: Received update to 00998 iterations after 1514.069s.
2023-10-07 23:22:19.090 Iray [INFO] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.0 IRAY rend progr: Received update to 00999 iterations after 1515.507s.
2023-10-07 23:22:19.111 Iray [INFO] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.0 IRAY rend info : Available GPU memory has increased since out-of-memory failure. Re-enabling CUDA device 0 (NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070)
2023-10-07 23:22:20.497 Iray [INFO] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.0 IRAY rend info : Rendering with 1 device(s):
2023-10-07 23:22:20.497 Iray [INFO] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.0 IRAY rend info : CUDA device 0 (NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070)
2023-10-07 23:22:20.497 Iray [INFO] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.0 IRAY rend info : Rendering...
2023-10-07 23:22:20.503 Iray [INFO] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.0 IRAY rend progr: Received update to 01000 iterations after 1516.907s.
2023-10-07 23:22:20.510 Iray [INFO] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.0 IRAY rend progr: Maximum number of samples reached.
2023-10-07 23:22:20.888 [INFO] :: Saved image: C:\Users\XX\AppData\Roaming\DAZ 3D\Studio4\temp\render\r.png
2023-10-07 23:22:20.895 [INFO] :: Finished Rendering
2023-10-07 23:22:21.125 [INFO] :: Total Rendering Time: 26 minutes 13.66 seconds
2023-10-07 23:22:21.159 [INFO] :: Loaded image: r.png
2023-10-07 23:22:21.204 [INFO] :: Saved image: C:\Users\XX\AppData\Roaming\DAZ 3D\Studio4\temp\RenderAlbumTmp\Render 2.jpg
2023-10-07 23:23:39.447 [INFO] :: Saved image: C:\Users\XXX.png
2023-10-07 23:23:39.478 Iray [INFO] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.0 IRAY rend info : Device statistics:
2023-10-07 23:23:39.478 Iray [INFO] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.0 IRAY rend info : CUDA device 0 (NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070): 0 iterations, 0.001s init, 0.000s render
So it stopped after 1000 iterations, because you had set it to max 1000.
It used your GPU and that is good, so you didn't run out of VRAM. Although I would have expected that 1000 iterations would go faster than 30 minutes - but that will be based on the complexity.
In that clip it doesn't list what convergence rate it had reached, that might be a little higher up in the log.
I think you might benefit of having more light in your scene. I think the light from outside through the windows will be limited unless there are several really large windows. I would suggest to add 1 or 2 fill lights inside to get it to converge faster. It could be some (50% downscaled?) primitive planes set to emission, maybe 100-200 kcd/m2.
Thanks a lot for those informations, i will modify my settings.
Last question, is it possible that Scene optimizer plugin decrease the image quality (render image) or not ?
I will say scene optimizer is not your problem. It can reduce texture sizes and can remove maps that will take up ressources. It might be the reason that you can have the scene in VRAM and render on your GPU. The high res textures will only benefit if you do some real close up renders. It will not cause noise.
Could i try to use combination of GPU/CPU for rendering, does it helps to remove noise ?
Letting the renderer complete enough iterations removes noise, having enough light falling on all surfaces removes noise (relying on light bouncing round corners decreases the number of hits and so incerases the number of iterations needed to reacha s ettled value). Generally having the CPU both manage the render and participate actually slows thinsg down, so as long as the GPU is coping you are probably better off using that alone - though there is no harm in doing some tests.
It did run out of VRAM
"Available GPU memory has increased since out-of-memory failure. Re-enabling CUDA device 0 (NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070)"
aaarghh
That was happens when you browse through too fast.
I'd just like to add that CG imagery allows us to "Cheat".
Some of what's going on is lighting conditions. Many times we don't need the architecture in the scene when we're rendering the people, and we don't need the people when we're rendering architecture. Not always, but in many (almost all in my workflow) situations.
I only have a 6GB GPU
So I use specific HDRI that allow me to get the lighting right for the people, since they're animated and potentially will take the longest to render. I do get some of that because of the compromise I make for time constraints. My star character normally only gets 500 or 600 iterations while background folks might get dropped down to as low as 150 or even 60 in some cases. In those 60 iteration renders I can sit here and wait for the 300 frames to render since it's mere seconds each frame - and thanks to the way I have the HDRI Dome rotated it turns out pretty darned nice. A lot of that speed comes from those background folks being rendered at a distance too.
My Rosie renders are usually about one minute per frame at mid distance. (500 iterations)
And 1.5 to 2 minutes per frame closer up - same iterations
They're grainy, but it turns out looking nice when it's all put together into a final shot.
EDIT: Sometimes there's too much grain if I don't have the Environment settings right. It seems that lower lighting or lower direct lighting on the subject results in more grain for the same amount of iterations. So if I want it to look dark, I use filmmakers tricks, like using a deep blue and still use light. In that case I almost always use HDRI #21 or its Mirror! I use them so much I have my favorite HDRI numbers fairly memorized! LOL But that doesn't stop me from trying others as well.
Adding actual Daz Studio lights can really help too, if you need to.
Hi guys, today, i can see following lines in log file, whats sort of issue is it, do i have to re-check GPU feature before render ?
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2023-10-09 14:22:16.556 Iray [INFO] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.0 IRAY rend info : Available GPU memory has increased since out-of-memory failure. Re-enabling CUDA device 0 (NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070)
2023-10-09 14:22:17.898 Iray [INFO] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.0 IRAY rend info : Rendering with 1 device(s):
2023-10-09 14:22:17.898 Iray [INFO] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.0 IRAY rend info : CUDA device 0 (NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070)
2023-10-09 14:22:17.898 Iray [INFO] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.0 IRAY rend info : Rendering...
2023-10-09 14:22:17.898 Iray [INFO] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.0 IRAY rend progr: Received update to 04993 iterations after 7005.797s.
2023-10-09 14:22:17.898 Iray [INFO] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.2 IRAY rend progr: CUDA device 0 (NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070): Processing scene...
2023-10-09 14:22:28.529 Iray [INFO] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.2 IRAY rend info : CUDA device 0 (NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070): Scene processed in 10.631s
2023-10-09 14:22:28.529 [WARNING] :: ..\..\..\..\..\src\pluginsource\DzIrayRender\dzneuraymgr.cpp(369): Iray [ERROR] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.2 IRAY rend error: CUDA device 0 (NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070): Not enough memory for kernel launches (37.465 MiB (401.871 MiB) required, 0.000 B available). Cannot allocate framebuffer.
2023-10-09 14:22:28.529 [WARNING] :: ..\..\..\..\..\src\pluginsource\DzIrayRender\dzneuraymgr.cpp(369): Iray [ERROR] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.2 IRAY rend error: CUDA device 0 (NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070): Failed to setup device frame buffer
2023-10-09 14:22:28.529 [WARNING] :: ..\..\..\..\..\src\pluginsource\DzIrayRender\dzneuraymgr.cpp(369): Iray [ERROR] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.2 IRAY rend error: CUDA device 0 (NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070): Device failed while rendering
2023-10-09 14:22:28.529 [WARNING] :: ..\..\..\..\..\src\pluginsource\DzIrayRender\dzneuraymgr.cpp(369): Iray [WARNING] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.2 IRAY rend warn : CUDA device 0 (NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070) ran out of memory and is temporarily unavailable for rendering.
2023-10-09 14:22:28.719 [WARNING] :: ..\..\..\..\..\src\pluginsource\DzIrayRender\dzneuraymgr.cpp(369): Iray [WARNING] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.2 IRAY rend warn : All available GPUs failed.
2023-10-09 14:22:28.719 [WARNING] :: ..\..\..\..\..\src\pluginsource\DzIrayRender\dzneuraymgr.cpp(369): Iray [WARNING] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.2 IRAY rend warn : No devices activated. Enabling CPU fallback.
2023-10-09 14:22:28.719 [WARNING] :: ..\..\..\..\..\src\pluginsource\DzIrayRender\dzneuraymgr.cpp(369): Iray [ERROR] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.2 IRAY rend error: All workers failed: aborting render
2023-10-09 14:22:28.719 [WARNING] :: ..\..\..\..\..\src\pluginsource\DzIrayRender\dzneuraymgr.cpp(369): Iray [ERROR] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.2 IRAY rend error: CUDA device 0 (NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070): [Guidance sync] Failed slave device (remaining 0, done 0).
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You ran out of VRAM. Use GPU-Z to observe VRAM usage before rendering.
You have a 12700K, why are you only clocked at 3600 MHz? Did you disable Turbo? I'm running an AMD Ryzen 5 5600G APU on an AMD build, so I can only use CPU rendering. Your CPU beats my APU by a mile, but I can render my characters at 4K without any noise. Something strange to me is you running out of VRAM while rendering at 720p. Could you screenshot the scene for us, or is that something you can't share at this time? I'm thinking you're using something very detailed besides your character. Unfortunately, there's no one-size-fits-all solution. We need to know more about your specific needs.
As for the spot lights, I managed to crack that one after I [embarrassingly] submitted my thread. That's caused by overlighting your scene, so those are hot spots. To fix this, you'll want to adjust your aperture [F/Stop] and exposure in your render settings. This will automatically adjust the shutter speed for the camera in your scene, simulating more light being let in through the lens per fraction of a second. I'm a photography hobbyist, so finding these settings helped me deduce this. Once I did that, I was able to reduce the count and intensity of my lights by an EXTREMELY large amount. Higher aperture will also give your scene more depth, letting all objects, including your character, stand out from the walls.
IMPORTANT: NEVER touch your ISO!!!!! That is for experts. Alt + left click this just to make sure you didn't change this by accident. It will reset it. Or you can hit the default button at the top of your Render Settings tab just to be sure. Your Render Settings save to your project, so each time you open the project, will bring them back. Make sure to save after you reset these settings to default so that you can start from scratch each time.
The hot spots are consistent with the direction the light is coming from. You can trace imaginary lines from the contour of the body to the light source. Also, you'll get more hot spots where lights overlap. Be mindful of this when you use diffuse lighting, which will give you a wider spread. Direct lighting is also very hot. I've attached a sample of my finished character.
I have only three distant lights to produce this result. The overhead is set to specular to make the hair shine, and the there are two side lights for split lighting. This simulates a window in the morning. The character is 5'3 / 160 cm. So, the overhead light is at 10 ft / 3 m, the top window light is at 6'6 / 1.98 m, and the bottom window light is at 3 ft / 91 cm. All temperatures are under 3500 K. All intensities are under 20%. All lumens are under 600. My aperture is under 4.0 and my exposure is over 11. There's one hot spot, and you'll be hard pressed to find it. Good luck looking for it lol Anyway, I originally had seven lights set to default. That's what I mean by an extreme reduction in the count and intensity of my lights.
Render settings: Quad HD 1440p (I didn't need 4K for this one), 16:9 aspect ratio, Render Type - Still Image (Current Frame), Render Target - New Window (for previewing before saving), Auto Headlamp - Never, Render Mode - Photoreal, Max Samples 1100, Rendering Quality Enable - On, Rendering Quality - 1.20, Rendering converged Ratio - 100% (default is 95%).
More specific camera settings (in Render Settings tab): Exposure Value - 11.30, F/Stop (aperture) - 3.30, Burn Highlights Per Component - Off, Burn Highlights - 0.10.
Every unnamed setting is stock. Pay close attention to your highlights settings to avoid unpleasant glare on your bright shades and colors. Burning highlights causes that. These are starting points and key settings to mess around with. You won't want to depend on them for your project. My character doesn't have a background, while yours does. If you still have trouble, you could try rendering your character separately from your scene, then using photo editing software to put them together. When a solution can't be found, workaround, workaround!
The thing about Iray rendering is that the renderer doesn't know when it's finished. It'll just keep refining the image forever unless you tell it to stop. The settings in the Progressive Rendering tab do just that - they tell it when to stop based on (up to) three criteria:
Convergence is the closest thing to a "percent finished" number. It measures the percentage of pixels in your image that remained (more-or-less) the same from one iteration to the next - that's why it's 0% for a long time at the start of a render, then rushes through to 80% or so, then takes a long time to get close to 100% as it hammers away at resolving the shadows.
In my opinion, it doesn't make sense to use time or samples as a stop criteria - you can't predict how long a render will take, so why limit it? Set those two targets to zero so they're ignored, and rely upon convergence to stop the render. Be aware that a render can take several hours when just using the CPU - when I had a slow machine, I used to pose scenes during my available time, then let them render while I was asleep or at work (or asleep at work).
ISO is just an exposure settings - in Iray all of the standard exposure options in Render Settings (ISO, fStop, shutter speed) have the same effect, and you certainly want to adjust the exposure using one or more of them to match the lighting (rather than adjusting the lighting to work with the default bright outdoor settings).