Suggestions on horrible topology repair from 3rd party purchase
Ben Oaks
Posts: 68
in The Commons
I recently purchased a unique set of clothing models from a third party vendor. They looked great in the presentation, but when inspected in blender the topology is erratic and doesn't transfer well for use in Daz. Is there a way to make these work in Daz? There are horrible artifact protrusions when posed. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Topology.png
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Comments
The mesh topology between PAs can vary a lot, also here at Daz.
Acually the mesh in the 3rd party is something that might come from Marvelous Designer.
And the mesh topology in itself (odd quads vs regular quads) should not affect how it bends.
Is the 3rd party intended for dForce?
If it creates artifacts I would more look at the weightpainting.
Can you share a picture of these artifacts?
Yes.
The attached image is from me asking the vendor if they could try and fix the issue. I had searched for reasons for the destortions, and weight mapping came up. I just don't know how to fix it. If you have suggestions please let me know.
Have you yourself used Transfer Utility on the clothing?
It looks like a typical case from that where it assigns weight to each leg with a too hard boarder, so when you move one leg only part of the mesh follows.
It can be solved by smoothing the weights.
Mada or WP Guru might have a video on weightpainting (or others).
Have you tried adding dForce modifier to it and run a simulation?
I purchased several items from the vendor. Some were full sets of clothing as a single mesh. I separated the mesh into parts like pants, shirt, gloves etc. Only certain ones worked with deforce. Most just fell apart. The vendor claimed that they had no complaints from any customers which seemed od to me. They are made for G8 Male and female. I can't be the only one with these issues.
I will do some research, and see if I can find a weight mapping tutorial. I fear I will probably have wasted the money though. Thank you for your insights.
With all due respect, if the vendor made those items for G8 male and female, why do you feel compelled to re-rig them yourself? Did the vendor provide them "for G8 male and female" but not rig them? (That sounds absurd.)
If you do not understand the content creation pipeline, then there are numerous ways in which you can mess it up and cause artefacts.
If you want to begin the content creation pipeline and rig a piece of clothing, it is best to use Transfer Utility on a "tight" version of the clothing so that weights are automatically projected onto the clothing from the source figure correctly. THe transfer utility projection algorithm is not psychic and it is not perfect and will not be able to transfer weights correctly 100% of the time. Attributing this issue to "bad topology" is presumptuous on your part. The topology looks bad, sure, but it doesnt look so bad that it would not work with Transfer Utility if done correctly. If transfer utility fails to assign weights correctly, you can tweak weights with the the weight paint brush.
Where weight painting fails for bends, you can use CBS. Sickleyield has a tutorial on weight painting and making JCMs for clothing. On the store, Esha has complete tutorials for content creation. Im sure GP guru has some videos on transfer utility. Edit: and Mada of course!
If the item is not sold as Daz Studio ready then the vendor is not responsible for making it work in DS... it does look like your problem is weightmap related. Daz PAs spend a lot of time fixing issues like that as well as morphs/JCMs etc, clothing straight out of MD needs a lot of work, especially if you want to use dforce on it. Are you exporting the clothing yourself from MD? Make sure you have weld selected when you export, that will go a long way from stopping everything from falling apart.
Good info on MD to Daz3d : https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/417911/marvelous-designer-to-daz-3d-workflow-tutorial
I have some weightmapping tutorials as well : https://dazstudioexperts.com/ :)
I have purchased a few 3rd party items which were made in the program that those likely came from. It's a rare find to have them "ready" for use in D/S, normally some work has to be done on the mesh. Anything from basic welding to removing unnessary mesh, it can be rather time consuming. So sometimes it's faster to use the purchased mesh sort of like a template to create a new mesh from, in essence keeping the mesh parts that work and replacing the rest with new mesh.
Not everybody bothers trying to help vendors improve their work, a few will listen but most can't be bothered. Some make repeat sales and some never do and may or not ever wonder why.
I found one of the problems. The items are not properly fabricated. I believe they call this a welding issue. These unconnected vertices are all over the first single item ( a pair of medieval boots) that I started inspecting within blender. Thanks for all of the comments. I'm not a content creator, and I don't model items. I'm just trying to make a project and came across these items when searching for medieval clothing. Like I said the presentation looked original and very nice. Thank you again.
Why isn't https://dazstudioexperts.com/ being shouted from the rooftops? A Mada collar tutorial would be welcomed.
If that's the case (welding issues) you should ask the vendor to correct the issues and issue a product update.
I just asked for them to load the objects in Daz and let me know if they can get them to work. I asked for proof, and if non is provided I would expect a refund. I've spent 6 hours trying several different suggestions, and some are procedures I am just not willing to dive into. Again, thank you for all the comments (even those that weren't even helpful).
As per the topology shown in the OP's image, the clothing was made in Marvelous Designer, with its mesh quadrangulated. It's pretty commonly-seen on the garments made with MD without further remesh or retopology... but they can work pretty well in DS.
The issue around the crotch area comes from the weight. If you rig the pants yourself, you better fix the weight or smooth them in Blender then import as an OBJ to update the Base Geometry. Those "swords like" geometry on the sides seemingly comes from Smoothing Modifier, you may set Generic in Smoothing Type, and/or try setting Bilinear in SubDivision Algorithm.
That "broken mesh" in the above image might not come from geometry welding from MD... that may come from mesh dragging while Simulating the garment in MD... check this thread https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/comment/8990686/#Comment_8990686
You better fix it if you want to make it dForce ready... otherwise the garment may explode or collide to nowhere in simulation. But fixing it may require more techniques as you mostly like will lose its UV with simple ways of fixing ~~
...and this is why I buy clothing at DAZ
sure I own Zbrush 2021 and other 3D modelling softwares, can half decently model clothing with great topology and UV mapping even but
damn my rigging, weightpainting sucks and JCMs are the stuff of arcane sorcery to me