FilaToon / Cell shaded rendering with Filament

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  • WonderlandWonderland Posts: 6,855

    3Diva said:

    Wonderland said:

    I started watching some anime on Netflix and noticed, at least in the particular show I was watching, that the lighting was totally flat. No shading on skin at all. The only shadows were ground shadows. Which makes me feel better because I can't seem to get lighting to work in FilaToon. I tried putting in colored rim lighting and it did nothing. But non-anime comics definitely do have shading so I will have to figure it out. I'm not sure why my lighting doesn't work even if I crank it up...

    Can you share a screenshot of everything in your scene tab? Sometimes that can help to narrow down what the issue might be. For instance, you need a Distant Light in the scene, I recommend NOT having an Environment Options Node, NOR a Tonemapper Options node and JUST using the Filament Draw Options node and adjust the settings on the Filament Options Node accordingly. 
     

    I'm not on the computer now but basically I was setting it up with a three point lighting like I would in iRay with the light on one side a blue or purple color and the other yellow, orange or green. Nothing seemed to show up. There may have been a little light but no colors. 

  • ImagoImago Posts: 5,144

    3Diva said:

    Did you try applying he Filatoon hair shader to the hair? That might help with the transmap issues?

    I was about to ask the same thing... I saw the new big anime school's promos and noticed that there's some transpmapper billboard planes for the grass in the yard. This means the transmaps can be fixed with Filatoon? It's a special shader inside that very product?

  • crosswindcrosswind Posts: 6,844
    edited October 17

    algovincian said:

    Hylas said:

    OMG

    please tell me this can be applied to other characters and generations.

    https://www.daz3d.com/filatoon-shaders-and-shapes

     

    I tried loading a G9 character with hair and and outfit (BJ Akki, SU Casual Style G9, and SU Everyday Long Hair G9), and applying "FilaToon - General.duf" to everything:

    2024-10-16 10:46:23.620 [INFO] :: Prepare asset load (merge): /Shader Presets/FilaToon/Presets/FilaToon - General.duf

    -snip-

    2024-10-16 10:46:30.560 [INFO] :: Finished asset load (merge): 0m 0.955s - /data/Daz 3D/Built-in Content/FilaToon/Tools/Script Loads/ApplyToonOutline.duf

    From the log, this took about 7 seconds.

     

    Then, I tried loading a G8 character with the same hair and and same outfit (BJ Sina, SU Casual Style G8F, and SU Everyday Long Hair G8F), and applying "FilaToon - General.duf" to everything:

    2024-10-16 12:09:29.614 [INFO] :: Prepare asset load (merge): /Shader Presets/FilaToon/Presets/FilaToon - General.duf
    -snip-
    2024-10-16 12:11:02.889 [INFO] :: Finished asset load (merge): 1m 31.144s - /data/Daz 3D/Built-in Content/FilaToon/Tools/Script Loads/ApplyToonOutline.duf

    From the log, this took about 93 seconds.

     

    Are others seeing a similar slowdown? (about 13X as long)

    Is this because I have more G8 characters than G9?

    - Greg

    ETA: This was in 4.23.0.3

    In this case, I almost reproduced the same issue on my side though I couldn't get that 7 secs in G9's case. Even if I did it on a G9 Dev Load, applying Filatoon - General shader onto 7 surfaces took nearly 28 secs. (screenshot 1)
    So I personally think you might've given it a wrong calculation ~~

    However, the real problem that I discovered is: (still with the products as you said)

    - if only loaded SU Everyday Long Hair for G8F into the scene, then applied fila shader onto the hair, it only took appr. 1.5 secs.
    - but then if alos loaded a G8F (or whatever Genesis figure) into the scene (without parenting the hair to the figure), loading fila shader onto the hair took appr. 15 secs.
    - then even if I deleted G8F, the above time had almost no change.
    - only if I clear the undo stack with the scrip of Purge Memory, 1.5 secs of shader loading time came back !

    So, I do believe there's a problem with the "embedded" process of loading Filatoon shaders.

    Edit :~
    Then the interim solution for fast loading may be : Always firstly load Wearables into the scene then apply Filatoon shaders. Then load Genesis figure, apply Filatoon shaders then parent Wearables onto Genesis figure.

    SNAG-2024-10-17-168.png
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    Post edited by crosswind on
  • SapphireBlueSapphireBlue Posts: 938
    edited October 17

    Imago said:

    3Diva said:

    Did you try applying he Filatoon hair shader to the hair? That might help with the transmap issues?

    I was about to ask the same thing... I saw the new big anime school's promos and noticed that there's some transpmapper billboard planes for the grass in the yard. This means the transmaps can be fixed with Filatoon? It's a special shader inside that very product?

    I was also super curious about this. If there's a way to do this with the Filatoon shaders, that'd be awesome for converting other sets for toon use. Does anyone have any ideas how this was achieved? 

    EDIT: I asked this in the Q and A thread as well, and got some helpful answers.

     

     

     

    Post edited by SapphireBlue on
  • algovincianalgovincian Posts: 2,610

    crosswind said:

    algovincian said:

    Hylas said:

    OMG

    please tell me this can be applied to other characters and generations.

    https://www.daz3d.com/filatoon-shaders-and-shapes

     

    I tried loading a G9 character with hair and and outfit (BJ Akki, SU Casual Style G9, and SU Everyday Long Hair G9), and applying "FilaToon - General.duf" to everything:

    2024-10-16 10:46:23.620 [INFO] :: Prepare asset load (merge): /Shader Presets/FilaToon/Presets/FilaToon - General.duf

    -snip-

    2024-10-16 10:46:30.560 [INFO] :: Finished asset load (merge): 0m 0.955s - /data/Daz 3D/Built-in Content/FilaToon/Tools/Script Loads/ApplyToonOutline.duf

    From the log, this took about 7 seconds.

     

    Then, I tried loading a G8 character with the same hair and and same outfit (BJ Sina, SU Casual Style G8F, and SU Everyday Long Hair G8F), and applying "FilaToon - General.duf" to everything:

    2024-10-16 12:09:29.614 [INFO] :: Prepare asset load (merge): /Shader Presets/FilaToon/Presets/FilaToon - General.duf
    -snip-
    2024-10-16 12:11:02.889 [INFO] :: Finished asset load (merge): 1m 31.144s - /data/Daz 3D/Built-in Content/FilaToon/Tools/Script Loads/ApplyToonOutline.duf

    From the log, this took about 93 seconds.

     

    Are others seeing a similar slowdown? (about 13X as long)

    Is this because I have more G8 characters than G9?

    - Greg

    ETA: This was in 4.23.0.3

    In this case, I almost reproduced the same issue on my side though I couldn't get that 7 secs in G9's case. Even if I did it on a G9 Dev Load, applying Filatoon - General shader onto 7 surfaces took nearly 28 secs. (screenshot 1)
    So I personally think you might've given it a wrong calculation ~~

    However, the real problem that I discovered is: (still with the products as you said)

    - if only loaded SU Everyday Long Hair for G8F into the scene, then applied fila shader onto the hair, it only took appr. 1.5 secs.
    - but then if alos loaded a G8F (or whatever Genesis figure) into the scene (without parenting the hair to the figure), loading fila shader onto the hair took appr. 15 secs.
    - then even if I deleted G8F, the above time had almost no change.
    - only if I clear the undo stack with the scrip of Purge Memory, 1.5 secs of shader loading time came back !

    So, I do believe there's a problem with the "embedded" process of loading Filatoon shaders.

    Edit :~
    Then the interim solution for fast loading may be : Always firstly load Wearables into the scene then apply Filatoon shaders. Then load Genesis figure, apply Filatoon shaders then parent Wearables onto Genesis figure.

     

    Hey @crosswind - thanks for taking the time to look into it and post your findings. IMHO, FilaToon is the most exciting new feature in DS in quite some time, as can be seen by all the buzz in the numerous threads here in the forums.

    Hopefully, the difference in the time to process between the g9 & g8 scenarios described can be figured out. I've talked to others privately who see similar results. I can't think of any good reason for there to be such a big difference, but what do I know?

    Lots of people are excited about being able to render near real-time NPR. Solving this problem would benefit many.

    - Greg

     

  • jdavison67jdavison67 Posts: 643

    I don't see how this is any better than 3Delight, which made a pretty good "toon like" render.

  • ImagoImago Posts: 5,144

    jdavison67 said:

    I don't see how this is any better than 3Delight, which made a pretty good "toon like" render.

    Rendering speed.

    I have some Anime and toon shaders for 3Delight but all of them requires extra render time than normal. Filament is literally instant and you can even have all the shadows in real time. That's why we NEED Filament to be fixed and improved.

  • HighElfHighElf Posts: 365

    Spotlights still give me a headache. The one that highlights the gifts needed to be very close even with boosted Lumen numbers. I wonder where the filament draw node nibbles on the distance for certain lights. 

    But to my surprise, the point light above her worked quite nicely. It needed only a little bit of adjustment. I guess I get distant light now. I wonder if I could use multiple distant lights for a 3P set-up.

    Eleanor Pin Up Box IV.png
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  • jdavison67 said:

    I don't see how this is any better than 3Delight, which made a pretty good "toon like" render.

    As Imago said - it's rendering speed - suddenly animating ideas will be so much easier. I could render a 10 second sequence in DAZ in a couple of minutes. That's a game changer!

  • bluejauntebluejaunte Posts: 1,901

    Don't think 3Delight ever looked this clean either.

  • Worlds_EdgeWorlds_Edge Posts: 2,152

    Late to the party, but ready to join into the fun. Can someone point me to the pdf regarding how to best use the shader? I thought I saw a reference to it, but I can't find it now. 

  • crosswindcrosswind Posts: 6,844

    Worlds_Edge said:

    Late to the party, but ready to join into the fun. Can someone point me to the pdf regarding how to best use the shader? I thought I saw a reference to it, but I can't find it now. 

    In here, under Mada's OP https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/704951/anime-toons-and-filatoon-shader-q-a

  • Worlds_EdgeWorlds_Edge Posts: 2,152

    Thank you :)

  • ArtiniArtini Posts: 9,445
    edited October 17

    I like the look of FilaToon renders after applying Cartoon filter in Gimp.

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    Post edited by Artini on
  • GordigGordig Posts: 10,041

    jdavison67 said:

    I don't see how this is any better than 3Delight, which made a pretty good "toon like" render.

    Apart from what others have said about the speed, it takes quite a bit of effort to make a 3DL render look as good as the base FilaToon shader looks. To put it another way, a low-effort FilaToon render looks WAY better than a low-effort 3DL render.

  • N-RArtsN-RArts Posts: 1,490

    I've got 4.23 installed, along with the updated files, and I can't find anything Toon-related anywhere...

  • 3Diva3Diva Posts: 11,432
    edited October 17

    N-RArts said:

    I've got 4.23 installed, along with the updated files, and I can't find anything Toon-related anywhere...

    Did you install and update the Default Resources for Daz Studio 4.23: https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/comment/8916886/#Comment_8916886

    Post edited by 3Diva on
  • ArtiniArtini Posts: 9,445
    edited October 17

    Little One looks nice in FilaToon

    https://www.daz3d.com/little-one

    LittleOne01.jpg
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    Post edited by Artini on
  • If you are having problems getting spotlights to illuminate your subject try extending the ray lengths in the parameters tab... seems like the light falls off drastically when it's not within the (super imposed) cone that projects from the front of the spotlight.

  • N-RArtsN-RArts Posts: 1,490
    edited October 17

    3Diva said:

    N-RArts said:

    I've got 4.23 installed, along with the updated files, and I can't find anything Toon-related anywhere...

    Did you install and update the Default Resources for Daz Studio 4.23: https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/comment/8916886/#Comment_8916886

    Oops. No, I didn't ^^' Thank you :) 

     

    Post edited by N-RArts on
  • Experimenting with faking effects and using iray canvases for FilaToon renders.

    So there are four lights in this scene. One distant light set to a dark purple with shadows, and three orange-ish spotlights outside each window with a wide spread and no shadows to add some glow.

    The light shafts are props from the Filament Atmospheres product scaled down and positioned at each window, mimicking a technique i've seen in older videogames to create fake light shafts. I also adjusted the glass of the windows to be emissives so they're affected by bloom.

    Finally, I used an iRay canvas to render out a depth map, making sure the fake light shafts were set to NOT be visible in render (this doesn't affect Filament renders at all, so you can set it and forget it), and used that in Krita to add a depth-of-field blur and to make the background a bit darker.

    I really wanted to add a Ambient Occlusion canvas too, but for the life of me I couldn't get any decent results from that.

    But yeah, aside from that one hiccup, i'm really glad with how this came out!

    Gallery link: https://www.daz3d.com/gallery#gallery=all&sort=newest&page=1&image=1352301

  • TheNathanParable That looks really nice!!

  • N-RArtsN-RArts Posts: 1,490

    Lilith 6 in FilaToon <3

    I'm looking forward to experimenting more with this style.

    Apologies for the watermark, I've just posted this to DevianArt. 

    lil6toon.png
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  • vrba79vrba79 Posts: 1,357
    edited October 18

    Rendering large and then resizing has none of the downsides that doing so in 3DL or Iray present.

    Filament is proving to be a huge win for NPR artists.

    Here's a render I did then photoshopped into an artsy-looking faux horror novel coverl

     

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    Post edited by vrba79 on
  • vrba79vrba79 Posts: 1,357

    You can use multiple geoshells with Filament apparently.

     

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  • 3Diva3Diva Posts: 11,432

    vrba79 said:

    Rendering large and then resizing has none of the downsides that doing so in 3DL or Iray present.

    Filament is proving to be a huge win for NPR artists.

    Here's a render I did then photoshopped into an artsy-looking faux horror novel coverl

    That came out very cool! Nicely done!

  • vrba79vrba79 Posts: 1,357

    Thanks. The original render was a nude that looked super artsy, so I played around with it, and made it glow in photoshop. That's when it reminded me of a lot of those old arthouse movie posters from decades past, so I creatively censored the original pic with a title drapped across it.

  • WonderlandWonderland Posts: 6,855

    HighElf said:

    Spotlights still give me a headache. The one that highlights the gifts needed to be very close even with boosted Lumen numbers. I wonder where the filament draw node nibbles on the distance for certain lights. 

    But to my surprise, the point light above her worked quite nicely. It needed only a little bit of adjustment. I guess I get distant light now. I wonder if I could use multiple distant lights for a 3P set-up.

    Love this! What coat is that? 

  • Want to double-check: does anyone else find that anime eyebrows 1, 4 and 6 just don't exist? Or is it just me?

    (Eyebrow 1 loads eyebrow 8, eyebrow 4 loads eyebrow 9, and eyebrow 6 loads eyebrow 11.) 

  • MimicMollyMimicMolly Posts: 2,189
    edited October 18

    Want to double-check: does anyone else find that anime eyebrows 1, 4 and 6 just don't exist? Or is it just me?

    (Eyebrow 1 loads eyebrow 8, eyebrow 4 loads eyebrow 9, and eyebrow 6 loads eyebrow 11.) 

    Yes, I've been missing some too. (Specifically ones that would look good on my OCs.) I checked in my Runtime textures folder and some numbers weren't there. I assumed my download was just corrupted and was going to try to redownload when I have the time.
    Post edited by MimicMolly on
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