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Anime Toons and Filatoon Shader Q&A

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  • TesseractSpaceTesseractSpace Posts: 1,406

    Yeah, I'd love a way to have transparency and keep the outline but I think that will ultimately be up to the textures used on objects with transparent parts, like having the outline drawn as part of the base map itself. Which could definitely work for billboard objects, but not so much for things like hair.

  • algovincianalgovincian Posts: 2,611

    bluejaunte said:

    Thanks anyway, much appreciated :)

    Anything interesting you're doing with this shader? You got all that elaborate handrawn procedure going on, right?

    Like many, I've been enjoying the near real-time rendering using FilaToon. My algos are . . . uh . . . decidely *not* near real-time lol.

    Currently, I've been trying to address some severe slow-downs when applying the FilaToon shaders that seem to be related to g8 vs g9:

    https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/comment/8918526/#Comment_8918526

    Fun fun!

    - Greg

  • SapphireBlueSapphireBlue Posts: 959
    edited October 17

    Thought I'd experiment some more with older sets and trees - just going with the solution of removing the outline from the tree leaves so I don't deal with the block planes. Also tried out KA's atmosphere for filament (the mist plane option) since there's no DOF ability in filament to soften the background - this kind of helps. I only realized this morning that we can use skydomes in filament, so now I can put some of those skydomes from older 3DL sets to good use. I think I nabbed this skydome from one of 3DU's toon sets...

    Post edited by SapphireBlue on
  • SapphireBlueSapphireBlue Posts: 959

    TesseractSpace said:

    Yeah, I'd love a way to have transparency and keep the outline but I think that will ultimately be up to the textures used on objects with transparent parts, like having the outline drawn as part of the base map itself. Which could definitely work for billboard objects, but not so much for things like hair.

    I think for a bigger project or animation, it's worth the time to tweak those textures to draw in extra outlines for leaves and outfits and such. Must try that out soon... yes

  • MimicMollyMimicMolly Posts: 2,194

    Llola Lane said:

    Elor said:

    Llola Lane said:

    Ok.. I think I understand that... I'll give it a try :)  If worse comes to worse I can always render the background and girl separate.. then merge them together... but DOF looks more realistic

    That's how I did it for my Magic Broom render to get motion blur on the island: one render for the island, one for the witch and her broom (well more than one because I did one render per pokethrough to solve). Then, I applied motion blur on the island layer in Affinity Photo.

    It did take a bit of time because I closed Daz Studio before merging all the layers and did it a couple of time before deciding to keep the scene open until I was satisfied (and the machine I'm using to render FilaToon has all the content on a mechanical hard drive, has an old Core i7 4790K, so loading times are not short crying).

    Thanks Elor ... I may just try that... I did try to "get the focus off the background and on the figure you can try a "fade out" of the background by making the background surfaces an Emission surface in the Surfaces Tab."  But all it did was white out the building... I'm probably doing it wrong.. I'll try more tomorrow.. Past 3am for me now :) 

    I tried adding a big colored plane with low opacity to tint the background behind the character so he would stand out more. The plane just has to be big enough to fit in the shot/viewport. As for the color, whatever fits the color palette. For this one, I used a very dark beige/grayish brown, similar in hue to the stonework in the back. 

  • ArtiniArtini Posts: 9,458
    edited October 17

    Aiko Toon and Vicky 9 FilaToon render edited in Gimp with Cartoon filter.

    AikoToon05.jpg
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    Post edited by Artini on
  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 10,212

    OK.  I'm done playing.  I want to get back my regular shader for my figure.  I've removed all that I can manage but there is no "restore" option that I can find.  I removed the Line and reset all the surfaces to their normal amounts in the all the boxes that the toon shader color coded too but the figure is still looking too toonish so it's far from being back to where I need it to be.  I have a second figure in the scene and that looks correct in the viewport.  I'm obviouly missing something.  HELP?

  • TesseractSpaceTesseractSpace Posts: 1,406

    RAMWolff said:

    OK.  I'm done playing.  I want to get back my regular shader for my figure.  I've removed all that I can manage but there is no "restore" option that I can find.  I removed the Line and reset all the surfaces to their normal amounts in the all the boxes that the toon shader color coded too but the figure is still looking too toonish so it's far from being back to where I need it to be.  I have a second figure in the scene and that looks correct in the viewport.  I'm obviouly missing something.  HELP?

    You should be able to apply a normal shader or material preset to the figure?

    oh and make sure to delete the geoshell that is used for the outline

  • andolaurinaandolaurina Posts: 673
    edited October 17

    I gave that a try and it seemed to help a little. Rendering at a much larger size made the most difference. Thanks for the tip. I finally got a decent render with this list of tips:

    https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/706131/solved-with-how-to-workflow-how-do-i-get-a-less-blurry-pixelated-filament-filatoon-render

    3Diva said:

    andolaurina said:

    My Filament renders are blurry/pixelated. Anyone else have that problem or know how to fix it? Or is this as good as it gets? See attached.

    Did you try adjusting the anit-aliasing: https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/comment/8912036/#Comment_8912036

    Post edited by andolaurina on
  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 10,212

    Thank you.  I just loaded up another figure and made sure to save all my custom morphs I'm working on and now the newly loaded figure is what I need to see in the viewport.  I'll play with toon stuff more when I have the time. 

  • PixelPiePixelPie Posts: 326
    edited October 17

    This may be a newb type question and/or has been answered somewhere, but if I wanted to render one of the new specific filatoon items .. like the highschool, (I was considering on buying) without filatoon rendering can I do that? Is it easy to just turn it on/off or do you have to do a bunch of adjusting to each of the textures? I haven't installed the latest DAZ studio as of yet.

    Post edited by PixelPie on
  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 100,888

    Using a non-Filament Drawstyle or selcting Iray or 3delight as the render engine will give a non-Filament render, though you may well need to apply another shader (by selecting the object and whichever surfaces you want to take the shader then double-clicking a preset to apply it) to get useful results.

  • Llola LaneLlola Lane Posts: 9,343

    Moogee said:

    Llola Lane said:

    Ok.. I'll join in the fun... been playing with Filament... Does anyone know HOW to do DOF?  I can't seem to do it with the camera... I wanted the background blurry to bring out the character more.  This is Aiko 5 with a bunch of morphs and expressions.

    you could try basic depth map maker using iray canvas - theres a run through video on the product page.  

    Thanks Moog... I must say thought that I've not worked with depth maps much... They totally confuse me.  I'll have to give them another look :) 

  • Llola LaneLlola Lane Posts: 9,343

    MimicMolly said:

    Llola Lane said:

    Elor said:

    Llola Lane said:

    Ok.. I think I understand that... I'll give it a try :)  If worse comes to worse I can always render the background and girl separate.. then merge them together... but DOF looks more realistic

    That's how I did it for my Magic Broom render to get motion blur on the island: one render for the island, one for the witch and her broom (well more than one because I did one render per pokethrough to solve). Then, I applied motion blur on the island layer in Affinity Photo.

    It did take a bit of time because I closed Daz Studio before merging all the layers and did it a couple of time before deciding to keep the scene open until I was satisfied (and the machine I'm using to render FilaToon has all the content on a mechanical hard drive, has an old Core i7 4790K, so loading times are not short crying).

    Thanks Elor ... I may just try that... I did try to "get the focus off the background and on the figure you can try a "fade out" of the background by making the background surfaces an Emission surface in the Surfaces Tab."  But all it did was white out the building... I'm probably doing it wrong.. I'll try more tomorrow.. Past 3am for me now :) 

    I tried adding a big colored plane with low opacity to tint the background behind the character so he would stand out more. The plane just has to be big enough to fit in the shot/viewport. As for the color, whatever fits the color palette. For this one, I used a very dark beige/grayish brown, similar in hue to the stonework in the back.

    Thank you for the samples Mimi... It still looks crisp and clear to me... just a little darker... I'll play some more and if I get something similar to DOF... I'll let yas know what I did... lol.  

  • Llola LaneLlola Lane Posts: 9,343
    edited October 18

    Question... DO cartoons HAVE DOF in them???  Maybe they are not supposed to and I'm fretting for nothing?  Lol

    Post edited by Llola Lane on
  • t0mg_zt0mg_z Posts: 51

    Playing around with this thing. Took a while to figure out how to get shadows on her skin:

     

  • 3Diva3Diva Posts: 11,513

    t0mg_z said:

    Playing around with this thing. Took a while to figure out how to get shadows on her skin:

     

    That looks great! Care to share how you did it? laugh

  • PixelPiePixelPie Posts: 326

    Thanks! useful to know

  • crosswindcrosswind Posts: 6,969
    edited October 18

    Llola Lane said:

    Question... DO cartoons HAVE DOF in them???  Maybe they not supposed to and I'm fretting for nothing?  Lol

    Cartoon movies usually have DoF, but rarelly in anime whatever movies or bangumi. However, that still depends on what and how you want to show and express in a scene. For instance:

    - in Kung Fu Panda 3, there're DoF and non-DoF in difference scenes. In ss1, it was not necessary to clearly show the folks in background of course, so DoF was used. In ss2, the director wanted to show the expressions of those folks in background, so no DoF was used.

    - in Spirited Away, you probably only can find less than five scenes in which there's DoF (like the one in last screenshot, a Near DoF)

    So whether using DoF or not is still up to your choice as per the scenes you make.

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    Post edited by crosswind on
  • Llola LaneLlola Lane Posts: 9,343

    crosswind said:

    Llola Lane said:

    Question... DO cartoons HAVE DOF in them???  Maybe they not supposed to and I'm fretting for nothing?  Lol

    Cartoon movies usually have DoF, but rarelly in anime whatever movies or bangumi. However, that still depends on what and how you want to show and express in a scene. For instance:

    - in Kung Fu Panda 3, there're DoF and non-DoF in difference scenes. In ss1, it was not necessary to clearly show the folks in background of course, so DoF was used. In ss2, the director wanted to show the expressions of those folks in background, so no DoF was used.

    - in Spirited Away, you probably only can find less than five scenes in which there's DoF (like the one in last screenshot, a Near DoF)

    So whether using DoF or not is still up to your choice as per the scenes you make.

    oo thank you crosswind.... Those samples are wonderful... I'm gonna have a play with my gal and the background and see what I can come up with.  I'm a huuuuuuuge DOF gal so it's gonna take me a while to figure this all out.  :)

  • SolitarySandpiperSolitarySandpiper Posts: 566
    edited October 18

    Quick question regarding a couple of the setting within the Filatoon surface tab, namely the specular threshold and the specular smooth sliders... the effect of the shadow threshold and the shadow smooth sliders are immediate and obvious but i'm not seeing any effect from the specular threshold and the specular smooth which is a shame assuming (through theses settings) you could control the effect of the specular highlights in much the same way as the shadows.

    Does anybody know how or if this works?

    Thank you.

    shader settings.PNG
    419 x 1011 - 431K
    Post edited by SolitarySandpiper on
  • crosswindcrosswind Posts: 6,969
    edited October 18

    SolitarySandpiper said:

    Quick question regarding a couple of the setting within the Filatoon surface tab, namely the specular threshold and the specular smooth sliders... the effect of the shadow threshold and the shadow smooth sliders are immediate and obvious but i'm not seeing any effect from the specular threshold and the specular smooth which is a shame assuming (through theses settings) you could control the effect of the specular highlights in much the same way as the shadows.

    Does anybody know how or if this works?

    Thank you.

    You need to turn on Glossy Layered Weight... then Specular settings will work.

    SNAG-2024-10-19-004.png
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    Post edited by crosswind on
  • crosswindcrosswind Posts: 6,969

    Llola Lane said:

    crosswind said:

    Llola Lane said:

    Question... DO cartoons HAVE DOF in them???  Maybe they not supposed to and I'm fretting for nothing?  Lol

    Cartoon movies usually have DoF, but rarelly in anime whatever movies or bangumi. However, that still depends on what and how you want to show and express in a scene. For instance:

    - in Kung Fu Panda 3, there're DoF and non-DoF in difference scenes. In ss1, it was not necessary to clearly show the folks in background of course, so DoF was used. In ss2, the director wanted to show the expressions of those folks in background, so no DoF was used.

    - in Spirited Away, you probably only can find less than five scenes in which there's DoF (like the one in last screenshot, a Near DoF)

    So whether using DoF or not is still up to your choice as per the scenes you make.

    oo thank you crosswind.... Those samples are wonderful... I'm gonna have a play with my gal and the background and see what I can come up with.  I'm a huuuuuuuge DOF gal so it's gonna take me a while to figure this all out.  :)

    No problem ! Pls take your time ~~

  • DartanbeckDartanbeck Posts: 21,569
    edited October 18

    Aiko 9 with Vicky Dark Elf skin, dressed up as Heartbreaker for Halloween

    Aiko 9 Toon HB Walk A212.png
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    Post edited by Dartanbeck on
  • SolitarySandpiperSolitarySandpiper Posts: 566
    edited October 18

    crosswind said:

    SolitarySandpiper said:

    Quick question regarding a couple of the setting within the Filatoon surface tab, namely the specular threshold and the specular smooth sliders... the effect of the shadow threshold and the shadow smooth sliders are immediate and obvious but i'm not seeing any effect from the specular threshold and the specular smooth which is a shame assuming (through theses settings) you could control the effect of the specular highlights in much the same way as the shadows.

    Does anybody know how or if this works?

    Thank you.

    You need to turn on Glossy Layered Weight... then Specular settings will work.

    Brilliant... Thank you. 

    spec.png
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    Post edited by SolitarySandpiper on
  • Bunyip02Bunyip02 Posts: 8,611
    edited October 18

    G9F Anime Feminine - scene was post-worked in Topaz Studio with Simplify - Dynamic Boost filter.

    G9F Anime 1 TpzSmplfy.png
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    Post edited by Bunyip02 on
  • DartanbeckDartanbeck Posts: 21,569

    yes

  • MadaMada Posts: 1,989

    I love the tips and images you're all posting in this thread - thank you!!

  • Gendragon3DGendragon3D Posts: 176
    edited October 18

    3Diva Ela disse:

    t0mg_z disse:

    Brincando com essa coisa. Demorou um pouco para descobrir como obter sombras em sua pele:

     

    Isso parece ótimo! Gostaria de compartilhar como você fez isso? rir

    Hello everyone! I'm at a loss of how to render for Filatoon. Understanding that if I want a realistic image, in the Render-Setting, I enable it by default in NVIDIA Iray (MDL) mode. And in the case of Filatoon, how do you render a scene to be able to save an image? Thank you very much for the little angel who can help me. ^_^ 

    Post edited by Richard Haseltine on
  • GordigGordig Posts: 10,056

    Switch the rendering engine to Viewport.

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